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welcome to tails in the rabbit hole I'm

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your host Mick West my guest today is

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Brandon Fogle

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a prominent business leader based in

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Utah and the current owner of the

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mysterious skinwalker ranch which is the

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focus of a wide variety of reported

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strange phenomena from Supernatural

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visitors to cattle mutilations and UFOs

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the ranch is now the subject of a

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History Channel show the secret of

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skinwalker ranch the finale for which

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airs on Tuesday June the 2nd this coming

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Tuesday so Brandon thank you very much

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for being here it's a pleasure to be

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with you and what a wonderful way to end

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our week on a beautiful Friday afternoon

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well thank you guys it should be an

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interesting show I think so tell me tell

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me how you first heard about skinwalker

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ranch good question you know I first

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heard about skinwalker ranch oh gosh I

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think it was probably over a decade ago

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and I was at Barnes & Noble of all

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places in Salt Lake City and happened

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upon a book hunt for the skinwalker by

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dr. calm Kelleher and George Knapp that

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introduced the entire you know history

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at least up until you know 2005 the

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ranch and the mysterious events

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surrounding kind of their investigation

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and bought that book reddit thought it

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was quite interesting I read quite a bit

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so I read several books a week at least

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and and I thought it was intriguing

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mostly because it it really involved a

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piece of property in Utah and I thought

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it you know it was an interesting

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footnote in Utah history and and then I

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put it up on my shelf and really didn't

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think anything more about the ranch

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until called 2015 so I you know bought

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the book at Barnes & Noble just like

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anyone else and and was then later

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introduced to the ranch and mr. Bigalow

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in 2015 which ultimately led to my

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acquisition of the property the first

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week in April 2016 over four years ago

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so I guess when you first read the book

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you have probably somewhat skeptical of

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the events that were described within it

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would that be accurate at that time

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absolutely skeptical I found the book

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very entertaining I thought it is

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intriguing I thought it was entertaining

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you know it was it was a fun read and I

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really didn't look at it as anything

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more than that I didn't really consider

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the book a scientific kimura career or

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investigation you know I had you know

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had never met George Knapp or Colin

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Kelleher mr. Bigelow for that matter and

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I just found it to be probably most

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interesting because of its of its

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location but other than that approached

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it with a high degree of skepticism and

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I I hit I have up until really getting

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getting more into our investigation I I

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had always had it more of a healthy but

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skeptical look at the not only you know

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topics like the ranch but also the UFO

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phenomena you know ghosts orbs you name

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it all all of the high strangeness that

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people claim occurs in the world what

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was the the tipping point for you then

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when you kind of flipped over from being

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skeptical about all these phenomena to

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actually thinking that there might be

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something to them or at least something

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to what's going on in the ranch yeah

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good question you know I you know I flew

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down to Las Vegas in 2015 and spent many

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hours with Robert Bigelow the previous

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owner at his Bigelow Aerospace compound

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which was quite impressive I I not only

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found him to be a kindred spirit in

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terms of some of his background in real

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estate development and whatnot but I

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found his interest in some of these more

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controversial topics quite

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quite intriguing and I was introduced to

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comme Kelleher and a few others during

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that exchange and you know sitting

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across from them and tearing their very

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sober accounts and explanation of events

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and what occurred on the ranch

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during their you know roughly 20 year

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ownership and investigation

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you know caused me to pause these seems

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like very credible people to me and in a

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lot of respects and I I would say that's

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when my my interest perked up yeah I

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didn't become a believer if you will or

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I you know I still you know approached

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the topic with a high degree of

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skepticism but I I tried to keep an open

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mind in approaching the the property and

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really carrying forward my own

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investigation you know there really

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wasn't much of an information exchange

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that occurred relative to the

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acquisition of the property you know mr.

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Bigelow was very clear about the fact

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that he he was selling the property as

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is I think he saw me is not only a also

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a fill of kindred spirit but but you

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know a rightful successor to hopefully

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what he had created and that I I told

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him that if you know if I had the

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opportunity to acquire the property it

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would be my intention to bring in my own

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team of experts of scientists in order

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to to document you know the events and

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really the nature of what had been

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reported there but yeah to be candid I I

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fully expected that there was a 95%

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probability or greater that's you know

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that there was going to be a natural you

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know more prosaic explanation behind

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what what had been reported and you know

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I kind of looked at the ranch and the

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the accounts as being probably most

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likely nothing more than an adult

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scientific snipe hunt of sorts I don't

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know if you you know growing up I was in

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the Boy Scouts I was an eagle

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thousands you know one of the one of the

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activities that we were involved in in

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scouting it was kind of a a rite of

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passage with the younger Scouts where we

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would initiate them through convincing

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them that they were they were tracking

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or hunting you know this this elusive

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creature up in the forests this snipe

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and you know and by the if you're

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familiar with with this with this sort

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of thing you know by the end of the

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evening all the young Scouts are

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absolutely 100 100 percent convinced

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they are absolutely certain that there

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is a snipe that there is truly something

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that they're hearing out in the brush

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that that they're either hunting or that

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is hunting them and I you know again no

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offense to to any of the people who had

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worked on the ranch previously at all

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but I I thought the most likely

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explanation for a lot of what had been

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reported was that that it was nothing

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more than the result of groupthink you

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know a lot of front-loaded groupthink

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and and the people had stirred

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themselves up into believing that they

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were seeing something unusual that most

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likely didn't have any anything

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extraordinary to do with so what what

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what was your goal then if you believe

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that

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majority of the sightings or just about

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all of those the things that went on no

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I don't think there was there was a

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fraction of them that have something

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that was worth investigating no I I

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really kept an open mind and I I didn't

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make any assumptions in fact I I didn't

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I didn't assume that any of the events

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were were true I also didn't didn't go

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so far as to discredit or say that they

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weren't true I I thought well you know

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what has come before what has been

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reported before you know it yeah most of

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which has been anecdotal in nature was

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not really easily proved and you know

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the only way to get to the bottom of

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whether there was any any reality to

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what had been claimed

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was to employ you know you know

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scientific tools and resources in

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service to to really studying the the

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ranch and to truly see if there was a

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phenomena work yeah people get talking

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about the phenomena and I think it's

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interesting that it's very difficult to

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pin down what this phenomena is that

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you're studying I Bigelow said once that

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they couldn't study it scientifically

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because he never repeated itself it was

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always something different so you

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couldn't you know set up an experiment

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to do the same thing and there's these

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various different things that happen is

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there a way of characterizing what this

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phenomena actually is or so-called some

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characterization of a phenomena just

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being other than just being a really

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strange place where things happen yeah

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good question you know I you you have to

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have something that is repeatable in

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order to thoroughly test the hypothesis

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as you know you really have to to be

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able to find repeatable results and to

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be able to properly characterize it and

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you're right you know in in approaching

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the claims associated with the ranch

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historically the the nature of what was

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being claimed was not only elusive but

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rather ambiguous and him and you know I

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I again I I came into this having never

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seen a UFO having never claimed to have

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seen a ghost or an orb or anything of a

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supernatural nature and I I honestly

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thought that the the likely result would

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would probably be you know finding some

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type of natural explanation for what was

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a Korean and frankly you know the first

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six months for half a year of owning it

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in all of my visits down to the ranch I

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I didn't experience it or or witness

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anything that I would say was unusual it

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just seemed like a very beautiful scenic

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backdrop in fact it's right out of John

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Wayne western movie

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or Westworld is probably a more relevant

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present point of reference I mean that

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the backdrop of skinwalker ranch is very

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reminiscent of what you'd see in yo

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season one or two of Westworld

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and and and I think that was probably

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the first surprise that I had upon

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inspecting the property was how how

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beautifully striking the landscape was

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and how diverse I mean you have

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everything from a Red Rock Mesa that

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spans the entire property to cave

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systems you have a number of old pioneer

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homesteads that are over a hundred years

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old that that are still standing barely

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you have you know some interesting

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waterways that traverse the property and

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and it you know that that was something

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that was completely unexpected you it's

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difficult to to really picture what the

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ranch lands gave looks like simply based

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on the description in George Knapp and

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calm Kelleher's book and when I came

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into to actually to inspect the property

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the week I closed on it I flew in via

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helicopter and I I was shocked at how

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beautiful the place was I was expecting

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probably more flat topography or desert

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Prairie type of type of landscape and I

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was wholly unprepared for vanity it is

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very very striking looking there's lots

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of nice drone shots in the TV show and

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you got the Mesa there with all the

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rocks tumbling down it and giant

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boulders and then the flat land and the

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river it's very interesting looking so

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you didn't he said for the first six

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months you didn't have any experiences

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have you personally had some kind of you

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know supernatural UFO type experience

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yes in snaps oh absolutely yeah that

274
00:13:17,889 --> 00:13:15,470
that you know what was recorded during

275
00:13:21,639 --> 00:13:17,899
the first six months before I really

276
00:13:24,280 --> 00:13:21,649
witnessed anything myself personally was

277
00:13:27,400 --> 00:13:24,290
was interesting I mean I you know one of

278
00:13:30,759 --> 00:13:27,410
the first things that I did with the

279
00:13:33,910 --> 00:13:30,769
property upon purchasing the ranch was I

280
00:13:37,689 --> 00:13:33,920
employed a drone aerial surveyor that

281
00:13:39,460 --> 00:13:37,699
the conducted numerous drone surveys of

282
00:13:41,410 --> 00:13:39,470
the property in the surrounding area in

283
00:13:43,359 --> 00:13:41,420
order to really document every inch of

284
00:13:45,249 --> 00:13:43,369
the property I wanted to start

285
00:13:48,309 --> 00:13:45,259
establishing a historical record that

286
00:13:50,079 --> 00:13:48,319
would track the landscape any changes in

287
00:13:52,090 --> 00:13:50,089
the landscape you know anything that

288
00:13:55,540 --> 00:13:52,100
would be interesting so we would have a

289
00:13:59,290 --> 00:13:55,550
baseline to continue measuring against

290
00:14:01,239 --> 00:13:59,300
as as we really let our investigation

291
00:14:04,359 --> 00:14:01,249
unfold you know the first several years

292
00:14:06,429 --> 00:14:04,369
of my ownership of the property you know

293
00:14:08,439 --> 00:14:06,439
I probably say the first three years was

294
00:14:11,799 --> 00:14:08,449
really characterized best as an

295
00:14:13,679 --> 00:14:11,809
observational science exercise it wasn't

296
00:14:15,609 --> 00:14:13,689
a lot of really aggressive

297
00:14:18,280 --> 00:14:15,619
experimentation like you see on the

298
00:14:21,509 --> 00:14:18,290
television program yeah a lot of it was

299
00:14:26,410 --> 00:14:21,519
was really carefully and methodically

300
00:14:29,110 --> 00:14:26,420
establishing the the surveillance you

301
00:14:31,989 --> 00:14:29,120
know monitoring and in some of the other

302
00:14:33,639 --> 00:14:31,999
instrumentation in order to to truly

303
00:14:36,449 --> 00:14:33,649
document what was happening on the

304
00:14:40,210 --> 00:14:36,459
property but to answer your question yet

305
00:14:42,720 --> 00:14:40,220
before I had my own experience you know

306
00:14:45,129 --> 00:14:42,730
we we had captured a number of

307
00:14:46,929 --> 00:14:45,139
interesting images and I think you

308
00:14:50,819 --> 00:14:46,939
picked out a couple of those images from

309
00:14:54,009 --> 00:14:50,829
that were you know seen briefly in

310
00:14:56,559 --> 00:14:54,019
Jeremy corbels documentary hunt for the

311
00:14:58,179 --> 00:14:56,569
skinwalker which was I don't know when

312
00:15:01,980 --> 00:14:58,189
that was released two years ago year and

313
00:15:05,110 --> 00:15:01,990
a half ago yeah I think so you know and

314
00:15:06,579 --> 00:15:05,120
you know to be clear I you know I

315
00:15:09,179 --> 00:15:06,589
thought they were very interesting

316
00:15:13,660 --> 00:15:09,189
images I mean we captured a few daylight

317
00:15:16,239 --> 00:15:13,670
images of unidentified flying objects

318
00:15:18,460 --> 00:15:16,249
you know I yeah I thought it was

319
00:15:20,889 --> 00:15:18,470
intriguing in that wouldn't we check you

320
00:15:24,369 --> 00:15:20,899
know the you know flight data you know

321
00:15:27,850 --> 00:15:24,379
the database history you know tracking

322
00:15:30,730 --> 00:15:27,860
you know the the commercial the private

323
00:15:32,769 --> 00:15:30,740
air traffic in the base and during the

324
00:15:35,590 --> 00:15:32,779
period of time that those images were

325
00:15:38,470 --> 00:15:35,600
taken by my drone aerial

326
00:15:40,450 --> 00:15:38,480
surveyor you know there were there

327
00:15:43,210 --> 00:15:40,460
wasn't anything recorded there was no

328
00:15:45,910 --> 00:15:43,220
there was no known traffic you know and

329
00:15:47,850 --> 00:15:45,920
I know I know very well that there are

330
00:15:51,580 --> 00:15:47,860
those that don't you know have the

331
00:15:55,600 --> 00:15:51,590
appropriate equipment and you have from

332
00:15:58,570 --> 00:15:55,610
time to time you know you know some some

333
00:16:01,330 --> 00:15:58,580
aerial activity that that doesn't show

334
00:16:03,460 --> 00:16:01,340
up on some answer but I thought it was

335
00:16:06,370 --> 00:16:03,470
interesting I thought to have multiple

336
00:16:08,350 --> 00:16:06,380
events that that were witnessed there

337
00:16:13,900 --> 00:16:08,360
were that had multiple witnesses with

338
00:16:17,100 --> 00:16:13,910
them of what what appeared to be unusual

339
00:16:21,550 --> 00:16:17,110
craft on or around the property or

340
00:16:24,100 --> 00:16:21,560
objects I found to be intriguing and

341
00:16:25,990 --> 00:16:24,110
that's that's probably when my interest

342
00:16:29,260 --> 00:16:26,000
started cooking up that was in June of

343
00:16:32,230 --> 00:16:29,270
2016 we had we had a number of events

344
00:16:36,370 --> 00:16:32,240
that that occurred that were recorded

345
00:16:37,990 --> 00:16:36,380
you know images captured and and you

346
00:16:41,800 --> 00:16:38,000
know what it did more than anything is

347
00:16:42,880 --> 00:16:41,810
it inspired me to improve our systems on

348
00:16:45,130 --> 00:16:42,890
the property

349
00:16:48,370 --> 00:16:45,140
you know our data collection you know

350
00:16:51,820 --> 00:16:48,380
and you know our camera surveillance

351
00:16:54,150 --> 00:16:51,830
system so we can better monitor and and

352
00:16:57,520 --> 00:16:54,160
record that which was occurring

353
00:17:01,060 --> 00:16:57,530
yeah that's those three photos that were

354
00:17:02,830 --> 00:17:01,070
your reference there I looked at those

355
00:17:04,810 --> 00:17:02,840
and I noticed that you had the metadata

356
00:17:09,340 --> 00:17:04,820
in the corner there they were taken with

357
00:17:12,819 --> 00:17:09,350
an iPhone 6s plus isn't a particularly

358
00:17:15,939 --> 00:17:12,829
you know good camera for taking photos

359
00:17:18,280 --> 00:17:15,949
of planes that are a long way away yeah

360
00:17:20,189 --> 00:17:18,290
I mean I get to me what you showed in

361
00:17:23,500 --> 00:17:20,199
those photos was very consistent with

362
00:17:25,120 --> 00:17:23,510
just you know in one case the black dot

363
00:17:27,550 --> 00:17:25,130
like you know some kind of fly or a bird

364
00:17:29,410 --> 00:17:27,560
and the other two can I look like planes

365
00:17:31,930 --> 00:17:29,420
to me you get the white cigar shape

366
00:17:33,250 --> 00:17:31,940
which is typical of a a plane scene at

367
00:17:36,160 --> 00:17:33,260
some distance and then there's another

368
00:17:37,540 --> 00:17:36,170
one looked like a plane higher up like

369
00:17:39,820 --> 00:17:37,550
something like you know something with

370
00:17:42,580 --> 00:17:39,830
the coloration like different livery red

371
00:17:44,710 --> 00:17:42,590
red wings or a red body but they didn't

372
00:17:47,680 --> 00:17:44,720
look too to me they didn't look too

373
00:17:49,450 --> 00:17:47,690
inconsistent with planes and you talked

374
00:17:52,360 --> 00:17:49,460
about the ad SB data

375
00:17:55,360 --> 00:17:52,370
which is the flight tracking data there

376
00:18:00,040 --> 00:17:55,370
aren't really any receivers in that area

377
00:18:02,830 --> 00:18:00,050
you you quite often see dropouts in that

378
00:18:05,200 --> 00:18:02,840
area because there's very few it's not

379
00:18:07,690 --> 00:18:05,210
very very populated I believe you have

380
00:18:10,480 --> 00:18:07,700
your own receiver on the ranch I don't

381
00:18:13,210 --> 00:18:10,490
if that was operating at that time yeah

382
00:18:16,240 --> 00:18:13,220
what you do see reliably is you do see

383
00:18:19,590 --> 00:18:16,250
the the air traffic that surrounds the

384
00:18:23,830 --> 00:18:19,600
basin and you can I mean you you can

385
00:18:26,590 --> 00:18:23,840
write it fairly reliably track you know

386
00:18:29,680 --> 00:18:26,600
conventional aircraft that are in and

387
00:18:31,510 --> 00:18:29,690
out I I will say the the the image that

388
00:18:35,200 --> 00:18:31,520
you're referencing relative to the black

389
00:18:38,260 --> 00:18:35,210
dot that was kind of over the shoulder

390
00:18:40,480 --> 00:18:38,270
of a gentleman that was not taken with

391
00:18:44,170 --> 00:18:40,490
an iPhone 6s with that was actually

392
00:18:46,120 --> 00:18:44,180
taken by by another individual it was

393
00:18:50,640 --> 00:18:46,130
actually taken by a visitor to the ranch

394
00:18:55,000 --> 00:18:50,650
on on the day of he was October 16th

395
00:18:59,920 --> 00:18:55,010
2016 and it was an icon it's actually a

396
00:19:01,480 --> 00:18:59,930
high quality nikon camera that that

397
00:19:07,000 --> 00:19:01,490
captured a number of really interesting

398
00:19:09,010 --> 00:19:07,010
images and it was a Nikon d5000 camera

399
00:19:11,380 --> 00:19:09,020
whatever that is so for what it's worth

400
00:19:13,900 --> 00:19:11,390
we have a number of images that were

401
00:19:17,380 --> 00:19:13,910
captured in June that were that were

402
00:19:20,050 --> 00:19:17,390
really randomly I mean not it it there

403
00:19:23,470 --> 00:19:20,060
was no expectation that that they were

404
00:19:26,080 --> 00:19:23,480
going to go out and capture photographic

405
00:19:30,270 --> 00:19:26,090
images of UFOs it's just you know it

406
00:19:32,740 --> 00:19:30,280
happened randomly and and those were the

407
00:19:35,560 --> 00:19:32,750
daylight images that you see depicted

408
00:19:38,080 --> 00:19:35,570
one was over the Mesa we often refer to

409
00:19:39,910 --> 00:19:38,090
we refer to it playfully as the

410
00:19:41,590 --> 00:19:39,920
Millennium Falcon image because it kind

411
00:19:42,280 --> 00:19:41,600
of looks like a Millennium Falcon from

412
00:19:44,260 --> 00:19:42,290
Star Wars

413
00:19:47,220 --> 00:19:44,270
because if we're gonna come with white

414
00:19:49,950 --> 00:19:47,230
lines and that view from the side yeah

415
00:19:55,420 --> 00:19:49,960
yeah it's it's a little bit similar to

416
00:19:57,640 --> 00:19:55,430
the tic-tac video in a moment you know

417
00:19:59,050 --> 00:19:57,650
that was taken you know the first part

418
00:20:02,680 --> 00:19:59,060
of June and then the other image that

419
00:20:03,350 --> 00:20:02,690
that that we that that same individual

420
00:20:04,940 --> 00:20:03,360
took on

421
00:20:08,140 --> 00:20:04,950
I phone that you know you see the

422
00:20:13,310 --> 00:20:08,150
metadata displayed for was actually

423
00:20:15,919 --> 00:20:13,320
above the their homestead one or above

424
00:20:17,480 --> 00:20:15,929
the main pasture right outside of the

425
00:20:19,970 --> 00:20:17,490
homestead and it was a it was an

426
00:20:22,100 --> 00:20:19,980
interesting object that was glowing that

427
00:20:24,710 --> 00:20:22,110
actually appeared right above the

428
00:20:27,440 --> 00:20:24,720
pasture and just stood there it was just

429
00:20:28,789 --> 00:20:27,450
stationary and then it zipped off and

430
00:20:31,970 --> 00:20:28,799
while it was sitting there for probably

431
00:20:34,730 --> 00:20:31,980
I don't know a minute or two without

432
00:20:38,180 --> 00:20:34,740
moving he was able to capture that image

433
00:20:40,549 --> 00:20:38,190
on his iPhone and then it then then

434
00:20:44,180 --> 00:20:40,559
whatever it was quickly departed but it

435
00:20:47,090 --> 00:20:44,190
definitely wasn't an airplane it just

436
00:20:49,159 --> 00:20:47,100
sat there stationary if there was a

437
00:20:52,730 --> 00:20:49,169
conventional explanation for it it would

438
00:20:56,360 --> 00:20:52,740
be a drone for example but it didn't

439
00:20:58,490 --> 00:20:56,370
seem to operate like any drone that the

440
00:21:01,250 --> 00:20:58,500
at least were familiar with or could

441
00:21:03,799 --> 00:21:01,260
actually match up with that imagery yes

442
00:21:05,030 --> 00:21:03,809
the Shamy didn't didn't take video of it

443
00:21:07,789 --> 00:21:05,040
which should have it yeah

444
00:21:09,230 --> 00:21:07,799
at least still photos have big problems

445
00:21:11,150 --> 00:21:09,240
because it's very difficult to get a

446
00:21:12,820 --> 00:21:11,160
sense of how fast things are moving or

447
00:21:16,190 --> 00:21:12,830
if they're moving at a constant rate

448
00:21:19,430 --> 00:21:16,200
very judging judging distance is very

449
00:21:22,700 --> 00:21:19,440
hard as well at the described one as

450
00:21:24,080 --> 00:21:22,710
being over the Mesa and and you know he

451
00:21:26,480 --> 00:21:24,090
looks like he said what this white thing

452
00:21:28,220 --> 00:21:26,490
that's over the Mesa but it was over the

453
00:21:30,140 --> 00:21:28,230
Mesa it would essentially be like had an

454
00:21:32,180 --> 00:21:30,150
air like a an aluminum rod or something

455
00:21:34,880 --> 00:21:32,190
because it's not not very yeah not very

456
00:21:36,260 --> 00:21:34,890
far to the Mesa from that spot like

457
00:21:38,840 --> 00:21:36,270
about half a mile or so

458
00:21:44,539 --> 00:21:38,850
Oh correct no it's quite off in the

459
00:21:47,440 --> 00:21:44,549
distance I mean but the visually you

460
00:21:50,450 --> 00:21:47,450
know the the object obviously wasn't

461
00:21:52,760 --> 00:21:50,460
stationary literally above the Mesa it

462
00:21:55,789 --> 00:21:52,770
was it was literally looking to the

463
00:21:58,610 --> 00:21:55,799
north of Homestead one or the main ranch

464
00:22:01,419 --> 00:21:58,620
house over the Mesa out into the

465
00:22:03,770 --> 00:22:01,429
distance so it was probably more clearly

466
00:22:07,070 --> 00:22:03,780
oriented somewhere around bottle hollow

467
00:22:09,860 --> 00:22:07,080
or up in that vicinity I mean it's you

468
00:22:11,510 --> 00:22:09,870
know with that without other angles you

469
00:22:14,540 --> 00:22:11,520
know to allow for the other spatial

470
00:22:17,270 --> 00:22:14,550
awareness it's it's impossible to be

471
00:22:20,120 --> 00:22:17,280
able to identify the exact size

472
00:22:22,430 --> 00:22:20,130
and scale and location yeah I think

473
00:22:24,620 --> 00:22:22,440
without knowing any context of Italy is

474
00:22:27,800 --> 00:22:24,630
just looking at that from I do a lot of

475
00:22:30,320 --> 00:22:27,810
like playing analyzing data from that

476
00:22:32,390 --> 00:22:30,330
type of thing and it could well be a a

477
00:22:34,640 --> 00:22:32,400
plane at high altitude of 30,000 feet

478
00:22:36,020 --> 00:22:34,650
this is about 20 miles away I think a

479
00:22:38,270 --> 00:22:36,030
lot of people don't realize how far away

480
00:22:41,000 --> 00:22:38,280
planes are when you're looking kind of

481
00:22:42,890 --> 00:22:41,010
you know over there rather than over 45

482
00:22:44,120 --> 00:22:42,900
degrees it's a fairly low angle

483
00:22:48,140 --> 00:22:44,130
essentially when you're just looking up

484
00:22:50,390 --> 00:22:48,150
over the Mesa yeah I see it appeared to

485
00:22:53,090 --> 00:22:50,400
be it appeared to be close right I guess

486
00:22:56,230 --> 00:22:53,100
you know what I found most intriguing

487
00:22:59,690 --> 00:22:56,240
was the fact that there wasn't any

488
00:23:03,260 --> 00:22:59,700
flight data showing anything coming or

489
00:23:05,330 --> 00:23:03,270
going from the vicinity or the basin in

490
00:23:09,260 --> 00:23:05,340
that area that would a lot that would

491
00:23:12,980 --> 00:23:09,270
align with that photo image I might I

492
00:23:15,860 --> 00:23:12,990
had the same the same suspicion when he

493
00:23:17,630 --> 00:23:15,870
when my drone surveyor brought brought

494
00:23:21,590 --> 00:23:17,640
me the image in fact he called and said

495
00:23:23,240 --> 00:23:21,600
I got this image on my iPhone I want to

496
00:23:25,610 --> 00:23:23,250
show it to you and I said I want you to

497
00:23:28,790 --> 00:23:25,620
stop any everything I said drop

498
00:23:31,070 --> 00:23:28,800
everything I want you to drive straight

499
00:23:32,960 --> 00:23:31,080
from the ranch drive two and a half

500
00:23:34,940 --> 00:23:32,970
hours to my office and I want you to

501
00:23:37,790 --> 00:23:34,950
plug your phone right into my graphics

502
00:23:39,770 --> 00:23:37,800
directors computer because I I don't

503
00:23:41,360 --> 00:23:39,780
want anyone else touching your phone if

504
00:23:43,610 --> 00:23:41,370
there's something legitimate that you

505
00:23:46,160 --> 00:23:43,620
believe you captured if you if there's

506
00:23:49,370 --> 00:23:46,170
something truly anomalous I don't want

507
00:23:51,500 --> 00:23:49,380
anything anything compromising either

508
00:23:54,560 --> 00:23:51,510
the metadata or the the integrity of

509
00:23:56,720 --> 00:23:54,570
that image and so when he brought it to

510
00:24:00,200 --> 00:23:56,730
me it was it was interesting following

511
00:24:02,150 --> 00:24:00,210
kind of the the initial analysis of the

512
00:24:04,700 --> 00:24:02,160
photo I mean the first place we turned

513
00:24:07,760 --> 00:24:04,710
you know was was really the flight data

514
00:24:09,260 --> 00:24:07,770
and that's when I I scratched my head

515
00:24:12,320 --> 00:24:09,270
that's when I thought you know that's

516
00:24:13,610 --> 00:24:12,330
interesting that we we couldn't we

517
00:24:18,890 --> 00:24:13,620
couldn't line it up with anything

518
00:24:21,560 --> 00:24:18,900
conventional yeah yeah yeah well I yeah

519
00:24:23,030 --> 00:24:21,570
I believe that that's what happened but

520
00:24:24,950 --> 00:24:23,040
I've had a lot of experience of people

521
00:24:26,990 --> 00:24:24,960
saying that they couldn't line things up

522
00:24:29,600 --> 00:24:27,000
with with the flight a so when you know

523
00:24:31,010 --> 00:24:29,610
I do a lot of the chemtrails conspiracy

524
00:24:31,280 --> 00:24:31,020
theory is one of the things that I look

525
00:24:32,930 --> 00:24:31,290
into

526
00:24:35,510 --> 00:24:32,940
a lot and so a lot of people say I saw

527
00:24:37,700 --> 00:24:35,520
this plane spraying and I couldn't find

528
00:24:39,410 --> 00:24:37,710
it on the on flight route at 24 and then

529
00:24:41,510 --> 00:24:39,420
they send me a photo and then I look at

530
00:24:43,010 --> 00:24:41,520
the data and I see it's actually a bit

531
00:24:45,680 --> 00:24:43,020
further away or a bit to the left or

532
00:24:48,560 --> 00:24:45,690
something like that so it's unless

533
00:24:52,370 --> 00:24:48,570
you're had a lot of experience looking

534
00:24:54,020 --> 00:24:52,380
at photos and flight radar it is it is

535
00:24:55,490 --> 00:24:54,030
possible that's you know you can you can

536
00:24:57,350 --> 00:24:55,500
actually misidentified so of course it

537
00:24:58,250 --> 00:24:57,360
could be possible that it wasn't it

538
00:24:59,780 --> 00:24:58,260
wasn't on the radar

539
00:25:02,090 --> 00:24:59,790
honey could have costly possible that it

540
00:25:03,980 --> 00:25:02,100
was some kind of weird unusual flying

541
00:25:07,910 --> 00:25:03,990
object or a drone or something and sir

542
00:25:10,040 --> 00:25:07,920
it's obviously not conclusive I mean

543
00:25:12,770 --> 00:25:10,050
I've been very careful not to claim that

544
00:25:14,900 --> 00:25:12,780
it's a you know that it's a an alien

545
00:25:17,180 --> 00:25:14,910
craft or anything of that nature only

546
00:25:19,970 --> 00:25:17,190
that we find that's the the

547
00:25:23,030 --> 00:25:19,980
circumstances surrounding you know the

548
00:25:27,110 --> 00:25:23,040
the photography yet that image and and

549
00:25:30,550 --> 00:25:27,120
the lack of the lack of evidence of

550
00:25:34,100 --> 00:25:30,560
anything conventional yeah I think bears

551
00:25:36,140 --> 00:25:34,110
some further investigation and at the

552
00:25:39,770 --> 00:25:36,150
very least what it did is it inspired me

553
00:25:42,530 --> 00:25:39,780
to try to carefully improve our data

554
00:25:44,570 --> 00:25:42,540
logging and surveillance efforts out at

555
00:25:46,880 --> 00:25:44,580
the ranch I mean it has been a process

556
00:25:49,160 --> 00:25:46,890
not an event you know we see that

557
00:25:51,140 --> 00:25:49,170
evidence with the television program as

558
00:25:53,710 --> 00:25:51,150
well it's you know we're learning a lot

559
00:25:57,230 --> 00:25:53,720
in were making incremental improvements

560
00:25:59,870 --> 00:25:57,240
so you said these these three images and

561
00:26:02,150 --> 00:25:59,880
other things around like 2016 work and

562
00:26:03,320 --> 00:26:02,160
what triggered your your your interest

563
00:26:05,480 --> 00:26:03,330
and your feeling that there was

564
00:26:08,510 --> 00:26:05,490
something really worth investigating or

565
00:26:10,550 --> 00:26:08,520
you know I accelerated that process but

566
00:26:14,780 --> 00:26:10,560
have you personally seen anything with

567
00:26:17,630 --> 00:26:14,790
your own eyes that is unusual yeah in

568
00:26:20,360 --> 00:26:17,640
fact you know we we had we had a

569
00:26:23,120 --> 00:26:20,370
circumstance in October 2016 where we

570
00:26:25,670 --> 00:26:23,130
were entertaining some prominent

571
00:26:27,890 --> 00:26:25,680
visitors that flew in for the day

572
00:26:31,460 --> 00:26:27,900
in fact the the senior member of that

573
00:26:33,800 --> 00:26:31,470
group you know heads had had wanted to

574
00:26:36,430 --> 00:26:33,810
visit the ranch for many years had

575
00:26:39,860 --> 00:26:36,440
apparently approached the the Bigelow

576
00:26:43,400 --> 00:26:39,870
people in order to get get permission

577
00:26:46,640 --> 00:26:43,410
and was not granted access and and when

578
00:26:50,070 --> 00:26:46,650
when he reached out to me

579
00:26:52,170 --> 00:26:50,080
you know some science advisors I I was

580
00:26:53,970 --> 00:26:52,180
open and I said look as long as you sign

581
00:26:55,800 --> 00:26:53,980
a liability waiver and a confidentiality

582
00:26:58,440 --> 00:26:55,810
agreement I don't have any problem

583
00:27:00,930 --> 00:26:58,450
hosting you and your team for the day

584
00:27:03,360 --> 00:27:00,940
and so we welcomed them out to the ranch

585
00:27:06,030 --> 00:27:03,370
I had already owned the property for six

586
00:27:07,830 --> 00:27:06,040
months and had been visiting you know

587
00:27:09,480 --> 00:27:07,840
the property every month in order to

588
00:27:12,390 --> 00:27:09,490
kind of address what needed to be done

589
00:27:14,610 --> 00:27:12,400
in order to improve the the facilities

590
00:27:17,430 --> 00:27:14,620
there and also really wrap my mind

591
00:27:19,320 --> 00:27:17,440
around what you know what the

592
00:27:23,220 --> 00:27:19,330
investigation needed to look like moving

593
00:27:25,710 --> 00:27:23,230
forward well we we we ended up going out

594
00:27:27,660 --> 00:27:25,720
to the property with this group and it

595
00:27:30,240 --> 00:27:27,670
seemed almost immediately upon our

596
00:27:34,380 --> 00:27:30,250
arrival we had some frustrating things

597
00:27:36,630 --> 00:27:34,390
occur we had some cellphone anomalies my

598
00:27:40,740 --> 00:27:36,640
principal investigator that you see on

599
00:27:42,960 --> 00:27:40,750
the show was was very surprised to see

600
00:27:45,210 --> 00:27:42,970
that his his iPhone started

601
00:27:49,290 --> 00:27:45,220
malfunctioning for no apparent reason

602
00:27:51,750 --> 00:27:49,300
right up on the Mesa in fact you know it

603
00:27:55,620 --> 00:27:51,760
started it started wigging out and

604
00:27:57,900 --> 00:27:55,630
turning a magenta color and ting he was

605
00:27:59,520 --> 00:27:57,910
he was pretty surprised he was alarmed

606
00:28:00,810 --> 00:27:59,530
by what he was seeing and you know

607
00:28:04,680 --> 00:28:00,820
called me up to the Mesa

608
00:28:07,500 --> 00:28:04,690
I quickly hiked up you know the face of

609
00:28:09,990 --> 00:28:07,510
it and and by the time I got up there

610
00:28:13,140 --> 00:28:10,000
you know the foam wasn't malfunctioning

611
00:28:15,330 --> 00:28:13,150
and I just chuckled I said ah but that's

612
00:28:16,590 --> 00:28:15,340
funny and he he scratched his head his

613
00:28:20,280 --> 00:28:16,600
wife says you know I wish you could have

614
00:28:21,690 --> 00:28:20,290
seen this and so we proceeded and ended

615
00:28:25,140 --> 00:28:21,700
up taking this group out to the old

616
00:28:28,050 --> 00:28:25,150
homestead area homestead to and as we

617
00:28:30,750 --> 00:28:28,060
piled out of the UTV and the other

618
00:28:32,970 --> 00:28:30,760
vehicles that that were transporting

619
00:28:35,360 --> 00:28:32,980
these visitors and we made our way

620
00:28:38,370 --> 00:28:35,370
around to the front of the the old

621
00:28:42,120 --> 00:28:38,380
homesteads there you know the group

622
00:28:44,670 --> 00:28:42,130
collectively started exclaiming that

623
00:28:48,720 --> 00:28:44,680
they were feeling some vertigo in fact I

624
00:28:51,360 --> 00:28:48,730
was I was probably about I don't know 30

625
00:28:53,760 --> 00:28:51,370
40 feet away from the main group that

626
00:28:56,040 --> 00:28:53,770
had assembled right in front of those

627
00:28:57,780 --> 00:28:56,050
old homesteads and they were all I heard

628
00:28:58,290 --> 00:28:57,790
them all say wow are you feeling what

629
00:29:00,290 --> 00:28:58,300
I'm

630
00:29:03,690 --> 00:29:00,300
and you know they were all you know

631
00:29:07,680 --> 00:29:03,700
expressing some concern that they felt

632
00:29:10,530 --> 00:29:07,690
some some vertigo and so I quickly run

633
00:29:14,610 --> 00:29:10,540
over to the group and I don't feel

634
00:29:17,250 --> 00:29:14,620
anything but Eric Bard who's sitting

635
00:29:20,360 --> 00:29:17,260
there with that same smartphone that had

636
00:29:23,190 --> 00:29:20,370
apparently been experiencing some

637
00:29:24,660 --> 00:29:23,200
difficulty earlier he said he he says

638
00:29:27,480 --> 00:29:24,670
look at my phone look at what is

639
00:29:30,420 --> 00:29:27,490
happening and sure enough right there

640
00:29:32,700 --> 00:29:30,430
the phone was turning magenta was was

641
00:29:36,300 --> 00:29:32,710
malfunctioning and he was able to screen

642
00:29:38,850 --> 00:29:36,310
capture the that change on the phone

643
00:29:41,190 --> 00:29:38,860
yeah and so we which was great he was

644
00:29:43,170 --> 00:29:41,200
able did he had enough presence of mind

645
00:29:46,230 --> 00:29:43,180
and that's that's one of the problems as

646
00:29:48,030 --> 00:29:46,240
you've you've seen in in addressing

647
00:29:50,160 --> 00:29:48,040
these topics from a skeptical point of

648
00:29:51,630 --> 00:29:50,170
view over the years you know it's you

649
00:29:53,370 --> 00:29:51,640
know people don't have the presence of

650
00:29:55,650 --> 00:29:53,380
mind when they're in the moment to

651
00:29:59,880 --> 00:29:55,660
really properly document or record what

652
00:30:01,590 --> 00:29:59,890
they're witnessing and and he did he

653
00:30:04,320 --> 00:30:01,600
actually ended up doing a screen capture

654
00:30:06,480 --> 00:30:04,330
we thought that was intriguing and as we

655
00:30:08,340 --> 00:30:06,490
were all sitting there kind of comparing

656
00:30:10,350 --> 00:30:08,350
notes and everyone was saying gosh that

657
00:30:12,390 --> 00:30:10,360
was that was a funny sensation that was

658
00:30:15,180 --> 00:30:12,400
felt for a number of was probably about

659
00:30:17,130 --> 00:30:15,190
I don't know 10 20 seconds that the

660
00:30:19,440 --> 00:30:17,140
group was experiencing that collectively

661
00:30:22,080 --> 00:30:19,450
and this is a diverse group these aren't

662
00:30:24,810 --> 00:30:22,090
friends these aren't people that's that

663
00:30:28,440 --> 00:30:24,820
had met previously we'd brought together

664
00:30:31,470 --> 00:30:28,450
a diversity of participants for that day

665
00:30:32,430 --> 00:30:31,480
and and so it was interesting to see all

666
00:30:34,260 --> 00:30:32,440
of these people from different

667
00:30:36,330 --> 00:30:34,270
backgrounds experiencing this and then

668
00:30:42,630 --> 00:30:36,340
you know while we're standing there I

669
00:30:45,140 --> 00:30:42,640
noticed that the the main security yeah

670
00:30:47,190 --> 00:30:45,150
the gentleman who had accompanied our

671
00:30:49,980 --> 00:30:47,200
principal guest for the day

672
00:30:52,650 --> 00:30:49,990
that that had introduced himself as

673
00:30:55,260 --> 00:30:52,660
private security for this gentleman was

674
00:30:56,040 --> 00:30:55,270
absent and I thought welcome where's

675
00:31:05,610 --> 00:30:56,050
George

676
00:31:09,270 --> 00:31:05,620
minutes had elapsed as we had you know

677
00:31:12,060 --> 00:31:09,280
been comparing notes and I walked around

678
00:31:15,180 --> 00:31:12,070
the back end of the homestead to

679
00:31:17,129 --> 00:31:15,190
to try to see it where where this this

680
00:31:19,889 --> 00:31:17,139
gentleman was and as I was walking

681
00:31:21,960 --> 00:31:19,899
around to the back of the old homesteads

682
00:31:25,680 --> 00:31:21,970
it was like I entered an anechoic

683
00:31:27,269 --> 00:31:25,690
chamber a soundproof room and there were

684
00:31:29,849 --> 00:31:27,279
these audits it was there was an

685
00:31:32,549 --> 00:31:29,859
auditory sensation it was almost like my

686
00:31:36,239 --> 00:31:32,559
ears were boxed and all of the ambient

687
00:31:39,210 --> 00:31:36,249
noise to a degree was was completely

688
00:31:42,210 --> 00:31:39,220
muted and right there in the distance

689
00:31:46,830 --> 00:31:42,220
where we had parked the Ranger the

690
00:31:51,119 --> 00:31:46,840
Polaris Ranger UTV standing upright in

691
00:31:54,749 --> 00:31:51,129
the back of the Ranger was this huge me

692
00:31:58,859 --> 00:31:54,759
about six foot five built like a tank

693
00:32:02,580 --> 00:31:58,869
gentlemen and and so I continued to walk

694
00:32:05,099 --> 00:32:02,590
toward the UTV having this sensation and

695
00:32:08,070 --> 00:32:05,109
as I as I made my way and grew closer

696
00:32:10,109 --> 00:32:08,080
the ambient noise came back and and was

697
00:32:12,299 --> 00:32:10,119
restored which I thought was was

698
00:32:15,749 --> 00:32:12,309
interesting and I I yelled to him and I

699
00:32:17,489 --> 00:32:15,759
said George and this it it was clear

700
00:32:20,190 --> 00:32:17,499
that his eyes were closed

701
00:32:23,909 --> 00:32:20,200
he was standing fully upright in the

702
00:32:25,649 --> 00:32:23,919
back the back of this UTV and by the

703
00:32:27,839 --> 00:32:25,659
time I got up there his eyes fluttered

704
00:32:31,379 --> 00:32:27,849
open I said what what are you doing why

705
00:32:32,789 --> 00:32:31,389
is something wrong and he he looked down

706
00:32:39,180 --> 00:32:32,799
at me and he says well that was strange

707
00:32:40,889 --> 00:32:39,190
and I said so what's happening and he he

708
00:32:43,889 --> 00:32:40,899
said well as soon as all of you piled

709
00:32:45,659 --> 00:32:43,899
out of the UTV to make your way around

710
00:32:51,389 --> 00:32:45,669
to the front of the homestead I was

711
00:32:53,249 --> 00:32:51,399
paralyzed and blacked out and he says

712
00:32:55,799 --> 00:32:53,259
how long have I how long have I been

713
00:32:58,200 --> 00:32:55,809
back here and I said well it's probably

714
00:32:58,889 --> 00:32:58,210
been about ten minutes and he just shook

715
00:33:01,739 --> 00:32:58,899
his head

716
00:33:04,139 --> 00:33:01,749
and he said I that was the strangest

717
00:33:05,759 --> 00:33:04,149
thing I I don't know what happened I

718
00:33:08,039 --> 00:33:05,769
said have you ever had this occur in

719
00:33:10,589 --> 00:33:08,049
your life have you ever had something

720
00:33:13,200 --> 00:33:10,599
like this happen he said no his pretty

721
00:33:14,729 --> 00:33:13,210
stoic very serious sober man it was

722
00:33:17,789 --> 00:33:14,739
interesting that morning when I first

723
00:33:20,460 --> 00:33:17,799
met him I kind of chuckled and was

724
00:33:22,799 --> 00:33:20,470
joking about all of the UFO claims and

725
00:33:24,539 --> 00:33:22,809
the high strangeness and everything

726
00:33:25,590 --> 00:33:24,549
surrounding the property when we were

727
00:33:27,299 --> 00:33:25,600
getting them to sign the

728
00:33:30,299 --> 00:33:27,309
confidentiality and the liability

729
00:33:34,710 --> 00:33:30,309
waivers and and ice and I asked them

730
00:33:38,010 --> 00:33:34,720
point blank so do you believe in in UFOs

731
00:33:41,580 --> 00:33:38,020
do you believe in in the phenomenon and

732
00:33:45,600 --> 00:33:41,590
this this gentleman in particular said

733
00:33:49,409 --> 00:33:45,610
absolutely not I'm just here as security

734
00:33:53,159 --> 00:33:49,419
to accompany my friend for the day's

735
00:33:55,620 --> 00:33:53,169
events and he was he was very sober very

736
00:33:57,090 --> 00:33:55,630
serious in his statement that he didn't

737
00:34:00,510 --> 00:33:57,100
believe it but anyways I found that

738
00:34:02,990 --> 00:34:00,520
interesting and about that time as he

739
00:34:05,760 --> 00:34:03,000
got out and we walked around the front I

740
00:34:10,349 --> 00:34:05,770
looked down I wanted to take some group

741
00:34:14,750 --> 00:34:10,359
photos of everyone and lo and behold my

742
00:34:17,070 --> 00:34:14,760
phone was dead it was completely dead

743
00:34:19,740 --> 00:34:17,080
the battery been completely drained it

744
00:34:21,300 --> 00:34:19,750
was interesting I'll tell you we got out

745
00:34:26,310 --> 00:34:21,310
there and I had at least 80 percent

746
00:34:29,129 --> 00:34:26,320
charge on my on my iPhone and he was

747
00:34:30,570 --> 00:34:29,139
very frustrating simply because I you

748
00:34:32,849 --> 00:34:30,580
know that's that's what we've come to

749
00:34:35,490 --> 00:34:32,859
rely on for our cameras you know to

750
00:34:37,590 --> 00:34:35,500
record you know momentous occasions and

751
00:34:41,310 --> 00:34:37,600
whatnot and and as I walked around the

752
00:34:42,869 --> 00:34:41,320
the front I said Jesus my phone's gone

753
00:34:45,180 --> 00:34:42,879
dad it's completely drained

754
00:34:49,080 --> 00:34:45,190
well guess guess what the other's phones

755
00:34:51,389 --> 00:34:49,090
were drained as well and and so I said

756
00:34:53,159 --> 00:34:51,399
well we have phone chargers back at the

757
00:34:55,440 --> 00:34:53,169
command center back at the security

758
00:34:57,359 --> 00:34:55,450
trailer why don't we all you know why

759
00:35:00,120 --> 00:34:57,369
don't we all hop back in and we'll take

760
00:35:02,820 --> 00:35:00,130
our phones back and you know I I need to

761
00:35:05,280 --> 00:35:02,830
have access to my text messaging you

762
00:35:06,900 --> 00:35:05,290
know to my email me because I you know

763
00:35:10,320 --> 00:35:06,910
this is in the middle of the day middle

764
00:35:12,810 --> 00:35:10,330
of the week and I I stay connected 24/7

765
00:35:16,740 --> 00:35:12,820
to my office to my to my business I said

766
00:35:20,460 --> 00:35:16,750
I I can't just not have connectivity and

767
00:35:23,280 --> 00:35:20,470
so we we ended up taking the phones back

768
00:35:25,440 --> 00:35:23,290
plugging them in and decided to go back

769
00:35:27,870 --> 00:35:25,450
out to not only the homestead's but also

770
00:35:30,320 --> 00:35:27,880
to look at the what I call the

771
00:35:33,990 --> 00:35:30,330
observation towers or what is infamously

772
00:35:37,650 --> 00:35:34,000
referred to as the bait pens and I'm

773
00:35:39,390 --> 00:35:37,660
learning quickly not to refer to them as

774
00:35:42,299 --> 00:35:39,400
the bait pen

775
00:35:44,789 --> 00:35:42,309
which was a carryover from the Bigelow

776
00:35:47,880 --> 00:35:44,799
era that's that's really what they were

777
00:35:50,460 --> 00:35:47,890
referred to and you know that reference

778
00:35:52,620 --> 00:35:50,470
of course unfortunately carried on you

779
00:35:55,710 --> 00:35:52,630
know through the last several years as

780
00:35:57,359 --> 00:35:55,720
we have managed the property but I'm

781
00:36:00,779 --> 00:35:57,369
getting to the punchline here I'm

782
00:36:03,539 --> 00:36:00,789
getting to the to the event as we went

783
00:36:05,279 --> 00:36:03,549
back out and we looked at the the

784
00:36:08,069 --> 00:36:05,289
observation towers which are pretty

785
00:36:11,880 --> 00:36:08,079
ominous you see them on the show quite a

786
00:36:14,009 --> 00:36:11,890
bit literally know exactly you know they

787
00:36:18,089 --> 00:36:14,019
you know they're all you know enclosed

788
00:36:20,910 --> 00:36:18,099
with barbed wire fence and and they had

789
00:36:23,430 --> 00:36:20,920
their purpose back during the the

790
00:36:25,410 --> 00:36:23,440
Bigelow investigation and ownership it

791
00:36:28,140 --> 00:36:25,420
was it was interesting as we were making

792
00:36:31,319 --> 00:36:28,150
our way later in the afternoon back from

793
00:36:34,620 --> 00:36:31,329
the old homesteads towards the security

794
00:36:37,380 --> 00:36:34,630
trailer to to retrieve our devices to

795
00:36:40,230 --> 00:36:37,390
get our phones back all of a sudden

796
00:36:42,539 --> 00:36:40,240
behind me in this open air Polaris

797
00:36:44,430 --> 00:36:42,549
Ranger you know one of the individuals

798
00:36:49,079 --> 00:36:44,440
shouted and said hey stop the vehicle

799
00:36:51,329 --> 00:36:49,089
and I was driving and so I I tried to

800
00:36:53,700 --> 00:36:51,339
bring it to it to a stop and I said what

801
00:36:55,499 --> 00:36:53,710
what's going on I look over my shoulder

802
00:36:57,870 --> 00:36:55,509
at him and he's pointing up toward the

803
00:36:59,789 --> 00:36:57,880
Mesa which is on the left it's to my

804
00:37:02,130 --> 00:36:59,799
left or basically the north side of the

805
00:37:06,839 --> 00:37:02,140
property he says look at that what is

806
00:37:12,180 --> 00:37:06,849
that and lo and behold right above the

807
00:37:14,700 --> 00:37:12,190
the Mesa was a silver grayish disc like

808
00:37:17,549 --> 00:37:14,710
object and it was just sitting there

809
00:37:20,099 --> 00:37:17,559
stationary and what was interesting

810
00:37:22,170 --> 00:37:20,109
there were a number of Hawks that that

811
00:37:23,430 --> 00:37:22,180
had been flying that we'd been observing

812
00:37:25,349 --> 00:37:23,440
in the day and they were still there

813
00:37:27,870 --> 00:37:25,359
were some birds flying around but right

814
00:37:34,140 --> 00:37:27,880
beyond the Hawks above the the Mesa was

815
00:37:37,799 --> 00:37:34,150
this this object that you know was

816
00:37:40,589 --> 00:37:37,809
probably I mean just trying to spatially

817
00:37:45,380 --> 00:37:40,599
identify how big it was was probably 40

818
00:37:48,059 --> 00:37:45,390
to 50 feet long and in the three of us

819
00:37:50,759 --> 00:37:48,069
that were pointing up at it said what

820
00:37:52,349 --> 00:37:50,769
you that's what is that and then all of

821
00:37:53,309 --> 00:37:52,359
a sudden within about three to four

822
00:37:55,920 --> 00:37:53,319
seconds

823
00:38:00,420 --> 00:37:55,930
it changed position and it didn't it

824
00:38:02,489 --> 00:38:00,430
didn't float it didn't move in a in a

825
00:38:05,519 --> 00:38:02,499
conventional way it literally changed

826
00:38:08,400 --> 00:38:05,529
position roughly fifty feet in the blink

827
00:38:11,339 --> 00:38:08,410
of an eye almost like a video almost

828
00:38:13,380 --> 00:38:11,349
like a video game and it it shifted

829
00:38:15,749 --> 00:38:13,390
position to the north or to the left by

830
00:38:17,910 --> 00:38:15,759
50 feet and we all exclaimed we were

831
00:38:20,519 --> 00:38:17,920
like wow how did it just do that and

832
00:38:24,779 --> 00:38:20,529
then and then about three four seconds

833
00:38:26,549 --> 00:38:24,789
later it dropped to a to a position kind

834
00:38:29,309 --> 00:38:26,559
of a hover position right above the Mesa

835
00:38:32,459 --> 00:38:29,319
dropped about 50 feet again

836
00:38:36,599 --> 00:38:32,469
instantaneously a few seconds later it

837
00:38:39,749 --> 00:38:36,609
shifted again to the right and and then

838
00:38:41,640 --> 00:38:39,759
in the blink of an eye it was gone it

839
00:38:45,449 --> 00:38:41,650
literally it was almost like it was

840
00:38:49,499 --> 00:38:45,459
reduced to a dot and and and was gone

841
00:38:51,839 --> 00:38:49,509
the entire event that was witnessed by

842
00:38:56,099 --> 00:38:51,849
the three of us was about a twenty

843
00:38:59,489 --> 00:38:56,109
second event I was very frustrated

844
00:39:02,789 --> 00:38:59,499
because again we are our phones had been

845
00:39:06,989 --> 00:39:02,799
dead and you know it all happens so

846
00:39:12,329 --> 00:39:06,999
quickly but it it left us all very

847
00:39:14,759 --> 00:39:12,339
surprised and yeah it was so big this

848
00:39:19,339 --> 00:39:14,769
was not just some dot in the sky or some

849
00:39:22,969 --> 00:39:19,349
silver white or like looking you know

850
00:39:27,449 --> 00:39:22,979
object it was literally a silk rush gray

851
00:39:29,939 --> 00:39:27,459
disc in the fashion of what people have

852
00:39:31,920 --> 00:39:29,949
described for decades as being you know

853
00:39:36,390 --> 00:39:31,930
kind of your traditional flying saucer

854
00:39:38,609 --> 00:39:36,400
type of object and yep to this day you

855
00:39:40,499 --> 00:39:38,619
know what one thing that happened

856
00:39:42,120 --> 00:39:40,509
following that event when we all went

857
00:39:45,839 --> 00:39:42,130
back and we concluded our day and

858
00:39:48,259 --> 00:39:45,849
everyone departed my principal

859
00:39:51,779 --> 00:39:48,269
investigator Eric bard who by the way

860
00:39:54,749 --> 00:39:51,789
very skeptical he entered this with the

861
00:39:56,339 --> 00:39:54,759
same really mindset that I had which was

862
00:39:58,589 --> 00:39:56,349
you know there there was really a

863
00:40:03,660 --> 00:39:58,599
natural explanation for all of what had

864
00:40:04,829 --> 00:40:03,670
been recorded or at least claimed to

865
00:40:08,540 --> 00:40:04,839
have occurred on the ranch

866
00:40:11,280 --> 00:40:08,550
well Eric quickly

867
00:40:14,670 --> 00:40:11,290
you know after that day ended up

868
00:40:18,030 --> 00:40:14,680
separately interviewing the other two

869
00:40:20,730 --> 00:40:18,040
gentlemen and myself in order to you

870
00:40:25,050 --> 00:40:20,740
know independently you know take down

871
00:40:26,940 --> 00:40:25,060
their account of the incident in order

872
00:40:29,940 --> 00:40:26,950
to see if there were some consistencies

873
00:40:32,840 --> 00:40:29,950
or inconsistencies and I think he was

874
00:40:35,550 --> 00:40:32,850
very surprised in that our accounts were

875
00:40:38,220 --> 00:40:35,560
virtually identical we all viewed the

876
00:40:41,640 --> 00:40:38,230
same event we all essentially had the

877
00:40:46,110 --> 00:40:41,650
same the same the same experience and

878
00:40:48,420 --> 00:40:46,120
most interesting the the big guy George

879
00:40:51,600 --> 00:40:48,430
that I that had been there as security

880
00:40:54,240 --> 00:40:51,610
that that hit that had been read

881
00:40:58,530 --> 00:40:54,250
rendered catatonic in the back of that

882
00:41:03,240 --> 00:40:58,540
UTB during that earlier experience the

883
00:41:07,890 --> 00:41:03,250
next day ended up in the hospital and

884
00:41:10,560 --> 00:41:07,900
was nil for three weeks ended up

885
00:41:13,950 --> 00:41:10,570
reporting that for three weeks he had a

886
00:41:18,030 --> 00:41:13,960
he was he was very very sick and the

887
00:41:21,750 --> 00:41:18,040
doctors apparently I couldn't diagnose

888
00:41:23,670 --> 00:41:21,760
what what he was sick with it was

889
00:41:28,700 --> 00:41:23,680
flu-like it was almost a flu-like

890
00:41:31,230 --> 00:41:28,710
illness that that rendered him really

891
00:41:33,570 --> 00:41:31,240
kind of flat on his back he was

892
00:41:35,700 --> 00:41:33,580
bedridden for for a number of weeks and

893
00:41:38,520 --> 00:41:35,710
this is this guy's got to be one of the

894
00:41:40,950 --> 00:41:38,530
biggest most strong people that I've

895
00:41:44,130 --> 00:41:40,960
ever been around heard in my life and so

896
00:41:46,950 --> 00:41:44,140
so I I hope you don't mind the the

897
00:41:51,390 --> 00:41:46,960
lengthy account magic share but more

898
00:41:54,540 --> 00:41:51,400
details it it changed that day changed

899
00:41:57,450 --> 00:41:54,550
my perspective right yeah did I did I

900
00:42:01,950 --> 00:41:57,460
suddenly believe in aliens visiting from

901
00:42:05,040 --> 00:42:01,960
Mars or outer space no but did I did I

902
00:42:07,830 --> 00:42:05,050
have a more open mind you know you can't

903
00:42:09,720 --> 00:42:07,840
unsee something like that mm-hm you know

904
00:42:12,690 --> 00:42:09,730
and I think it what it did is it

905
00:42:16,830 --> 00:42:12,700
inspired me to use a bit more diligence

906
00:42:19,800 --> 00:42:16,840
and to to hopefully invest the resources

907
00:42:20,400 --> 00:42:19,810
needed in order to fully understand what

908
00:42:24,210 --> 00:42:20,410
was happening

909
00:42:26,579 --> 00:42:24,220
on and around that property remains

910
00:42:30,359 --> 00:42:26,589
remains in truth interesting that was

911
00:42:32,970 --> 00:42:30,369
that was the day I guess yeah yeah so

912
00:42:35,819 --> 00:42:32,980
this you know you all saw this this

913
00:42:39,079 --> 00:42:35,829
silver disc type thing like over the

914
00:42:42,599 --> 00:42:39,089
Mesa you know some just to the north

915
00:42:44,460 --> 00:42:42,609
did you afterwards when you you give

916
00:42:45,630 --> 00:42:44,470
your accounts did you draw diagrams or

917
00:42:47,670 --> 00:42:45,640
what it look like and where it was

918
00:42:48,059 --> 00:42:47,680
spatially and the size of other things

919
00:42:51,029 --> 00:42:48,069
like that

920
00:42:55,069 --> 00:42:51,039
yeah I'm like you that the the the

921
00:42:57,650 --> 00:42:55,079
motion path perhaps yes in fact that I

922
00:43:02,269 --> 00:42:57,660
immediately I went home and I tried to

923
00:43:05,609 --> 00:43:02,279
photoshop hey can it right very good

924
00:43:08,880 --> 00:43:05,619
Eric Bard Eric bards he wanted not only

925
00:43:12,690 --> 00:43:08,890
me to put it in writing he wanted me to

926
00:43:15,089 --> 00:43:12,700
carefully document my my you know

927
00:43:17,460 --> 00:43:15,099
testimony of what had happened but he

928
00:43:19,769 --> 00:43:17,470
wanted me to visually provide him with a

929
00:43:22,880 --> 00:43:19,779
with the reference or a diagram and so

930
00:43:26,700 --> 00:43:22,890
you know we we identified a photo image

931
00:43:30,569 --> 00:43:26,710
that had been taken earlier of really

932
00:43:33,630 --> 00:43:30,579
that portion of the Mesa and roughly you

933
00:43:36,089 --> 00:43:33,640
know within it within a pretty reliable

934
00:43:38,849 --> 00:43:36,099
distance I mean probably within I don't

935
00:43:42,299 --> 00:43:38,859
know a hundred feet of where we were

936
00:43:44,970 --> 00:43:42,309
part and witnessed that incident we kind

937
00:43:46,710 --> 00:43:44,980
of identified it a comparable image that

938
00:43:49,289 --> 00:43:46,720
we could use as a reference point and

939
00:43:51,569 --> 00:43:49,299
use that as kind of an illustrative

940
00:43:54,089 --> 00:43:51,579
example of what had happened that is

941
00:43:58,380 --> 00:43:54,099
good that's the way to do it yeah so

942
00:43:59,640 --> 00:43:58,390
very interesting yeah so you know you

943
00:44:00,870 --> 00:43:59,650
obviously you have lots of cameras on

944
00:44:03,660 --> 00:44:00,880
the ranch now and you've had these

945
00:44:06,299 --> 00:44:03,670
cameras set up for quite a while have

946
00:44:13,019 --> 00:44:06,309
have they captured anything of that

947
00:44:15,839 --> 00:44:13,029
magnitude of interest yes we've had a

948
00:44:18,749 --> 00:44:15,849
few we've we've had actually a handful

949
00:44:20,789 --> 00:44:18,759
of other incidents that have been

950
00:44:27,410 --> 00:44:20,799
recorded in fact both daytime and

951
00:44:30,359 --> 00:44:27,420
nighttime we've had a number of of I

952
00:44:32,450 --> 00:44:30,369
guess what you call UFO sightings at

953
00:44:35,480 --> 00:44:32,460
night over the ranch

954
00:44:39,680 --> 00:44:35,490
that that we have not been able to

955
00:44:41,930 --> 00:44:39,690
assign a conventional explanation to you

956
00:44:44,150 --> 00:44:41,940
know we're still analyzing some of that

957
00:44:44,630 --> 00:44:44,160
and you know I might say the sky type

958
00:44:50,360 --> 00:44:44,640
thing

959
00:44:51,890 --> 00:44:50,370
yeah lights in the sky and you know we

960
00:44:53,750 --> 00:44:51,900
kind of alluded to this in the first

961
00:44:56,360 --> 00:44:53,760
episode of the television program you

962
00:44:58,520 --> 00:44:56,370
know luminous phenomena you know on the

963
00:45:00,380 --> 00:44:58,530
Mesa that has been recorded and

964
00:45:02,900 --> 00:45:00,390
witnessed by people I mean we've had

965
00:45:05,690 --> 00:45:02,910
numerous witnesses coupled with the

966
00:45:08,900 --> 00:45:05,700
video imagery you know we've had you

967
00:45:11,540 --> 00:45:08,910
know night-vision footage you know that

968
00:45:14,630 --> 00:45:11,550
has captured some of this what appears

969
00:45:16,850 --> 00:45:14,640
to be anomalous activity and and along

970
00:45:20,090 --> 00:45:16,860
with that we've seen you know we've seen

971
00:45:22,070 --> 00:45:20,100
lights in the sky that have that have

972
00:45:24,680 --> 00:45:22,080
been very interesting in the way that

973
00:45:27,920 --> 00:45:24,690
they've behaved some of the behavior is

974
00:45:30,350 --> 00:45:27,930
not conventional UFO behavior it's not

975
00:45:32,780 --> 00:45:30,360
like a spaceship or some object just

976
00:45:35,120 --> 00:45:32,790
hovering it's you know we have one video

977
00:45:38,720 --> 00:45:35,130
where where we captured an object that

978
00:45:40,460 --> 00:45:38,730
is moving so erratically in its you know

979
00:45:43,310 --> 00:45:40,470
it's during a period of time in fact I

980
00:45:47,120 --> 00:45:43,320
think it was during December I think it

981
00:45:49,310 --> 00:45:47,130
was a couple of years ago right before

982
00:45:54,530 --> 00:45:49,320
Christmas I think it was December 23rd

983
00:45:58,210 --> 00:45:54,540
and the object was moving so erratically

984
00:46:02,710 --> 00:45:58,220
in so many different different ways that

985
00:46:05,810 --> 00:46:02,720
it it it was it was quite unusual and

986
00:46:07,490 --> 00:46:05,820
and coupled with that imagery we saw a

987
00:46:11,030 --> 00:46:07,500
reaction on the mace that we saw

988
00:46:15,410 --> 00:46:11,040
luminous phenomena that that seemed to

989
00:46:18,260 --> 00:46:15,420
correlate with the unidentified flying

990
00:46:20,690 --> 00:46:18,270
object or whatever you'd call it or

991
00:46:22,730 --> 00:46:20,700
characterize it as you know I you know

992
00:46:25,280 --> 00:46:22,740
one thing I continue to be reminded up

993
00:46:28,280 --> 00:46:25,290
on a week-to-week basis in fact I've

994
00:46:30,830 --> 00:46:28,290
heard this mantra probably now a

995
00:46:32,720 --> 00:46:30,840
thousand times during my ownership of

996
00:46:36,340 --> 00:46:32,730
the ranch and that has come from Eric

997
00:46:42,140 --> 00:46:36,350
bard who continues to say Brandon

998
00:46:44,000 --> 00:46:42,150
correlation is not causation he I mean I

999
00:46:46,300 --> 00:46:44,010
don't think there's been a week that has

1000
00:46:49,070 --> 00:46:46,310
gone by in the last four years

1001
00:46:50,510 --> 00:46:49,080
since bringing him on board and

1002
00:46:52,520 --> 00:46:50,520
acquiring the property and really

1003
00:46:55,130 --> 00:46:52,530
launching our investigation that I have

1004
00:46:58,280 --> 00:46:55,140
not been reminded of that that just

1005
00:47:00,770 --> 00:46:58,290
because you're seeing events that defy

1006
00:47:02,450 --> 00:47:00,780
explanation or seem to be unusual it

1007
00:47:05,060 --> 00:47:02,460
doesn't mean that the correlation of

1008
00:47:07,130 --> 00:47:05,070
certain events you know points to some

1009
00:47:12,170 --> 00:47:07,140
type of unusual cause you have to have

1010
00:47:14,630 --> 00:47:12,180
other data to support your claim so oh

1011
00:47:15,770 --> 00:47:14,640
this this is footage you've got and

1012
00:47:16,970 --> 00:47:15,780
you've got a variety of ones that are

1013
00:47:18,770 --> 00:47:16,980
interesting and you've got some where

1014
00:47:20,120 --> 00:47:18,780
you've got like a possible correlation

1015
00:47:21,859 --> 00:47:20,130
between things

1016
00:47:24,620 --> 00:47:21,869
if you obviously get all this like a

1017
00:47:26,660 --> 00:47:24,630
bunch of hard drive somewhere why don't

1018
00:47:29,030 --> 00:47:26,670
you release all of this footage and let

1019
00:47:32,750 --> 00:47:29,040
people have a look at it ah we're going

1020
00:47:35,510 --> 00:47:32,760
to you know I part of it is to be candid

1021
00:47:40,730 --> 00:47:35,520
time this is this is such a small part

1022
00:47:42,500 --> 00:47:40,740
of my life you know I I I'm you know I

1023
00:47:45,980 --> 00:47:42,510
work 18 to 20 hours a day

1024
00:47:48,050 --> 00:47:45,990
I represent several hundred prominent

1025
00:47:51,760 --> 00:47:48,060
commercial real estate projects you know

1026
00:47:54,680 --> 00:47:51,770
buildings you know right now I have gosh

1027
00:47:56,380 --> 00:47:54,690
well over a million probably at 1.4

1028
00:47:58,220 --> 00:47:56,390
million square feet of office

1029
00:48:00,859 --> 00:47:58,230
developments under construction right

1030
00:48:03,710 --> 00:48:00,869
now that I have responsibility for and

1031
00:48:07,780 --> 00:48:03,720
and that that has been the case you know

1032
00:48:09,800 --> 00:48:07,790
for the last 20 years of my career and

1033
00:48:11,840 --> 00:48:09,810
couldn't you just let tell one of your

1034
00:48:16,250 --> 00:48:11,850
investigators like put all the good

1035
00:48:17,810 --> 00:48:16,260
footage on a Dropbox and yeah yeah we're

1036
00:48:20,900 --> 00:48:17,820
working on it so one thing that we're

1037
00:48:23,410 --> 00:48:20,910
looking to release in the next gosh I

1038
00:48:27,530 --> 00:48:23,420
don't know my hope is by the time the

1039
00:48:29,599 --> 00:48:27,540
series finale occurs next Tuesday we we

1040
00:48:31,700 --> 00:48:29,609
hope to launch a web portal that I've

1041
00:48:34,310 --> 00:48:31,710
been investing in that will actually

1042
00:48:35,870 --> 00:48:34,320
allow for more peer review and the

1043
00:48:38,330 --> 00:48:35,880
release of some of these other videos

1044
00:48:40,940 --> 00:48:38,340
and anomalies you know they you know the

1045
00:48:44,030 --> 00:48:40,950
analysis that has been conducted you

1046
00:48:46,550 --> 00:48:44,040
know I I really want to take a very

1047
00:48:50,540 --> 00:48:46,560
collaborative transparent approach to

1048
00:48:54,230 --> 00:48:50,550
what we are experiencing on the property

1049
00:48:58,250 --> 00:48:54,240
what we are recording and and I think

1050
00:49:00,049 --> 00:48:58,260
having a more inclusive collaborative

1051
00:49:01,759 --> 00:49:00,059
approach with the community we'll hope

1052
00:49:03,799 --> 00:49:01,769
we help us get to the bottom of what

1053
00:49:07,130 --> 00:49:03,809
really is at work that skinwalker ranch

1054
00:49:09,529 --> 00:49:07,140
I think you will at the very least be

1055
00:49:11,599 --> 00:49:09,539
able to exclude some things because

1056
00:49:14,479 --> 00:49:11,609
we'll be able to identify some things as

1057
00:49:17,329 --> 00:49:14,489
aircraft or whatever this is something

1058
00:49:20,469 --> 00:49:17,339
that you know I think it's happened

1059
00:49:23,120 --> 00:49:20,479
before with various other UFO

1060
00:49:25,489 --> 00:49:23,130
investigations where people have kept

1061
00:49:26,779 --> 00:49:25,499
the data you know for themselves and

1062
00:49:28,849 --> 00:49:26,789
analyzed it and then when it's

1063
00:49:31,999 --> 00:49:28,859
eventually released to the broader

1064
00:49:33,620 --> 00:49:32,009
audience it's it's it can be like

1065
00:49:34,849 --> 00:49:33,630
analyzed and people actually do figure

1066
00:49:36,140 --> 00:49:34,859
out what it was even though the

1067
00:49:37,640 --> 00:49:36,150
investigators couldn't figure it out

1068
00:49:39,890 --> 00:49:37,650
just because they happen to have some

1069
00:49:41,719 --> 00:49:39,900
drilling specific knowledge like in a

1070
00:49:45,259 --> 00:49:41,729
very narrow domain that you know the

1071
00:49:46,969 --> 00:49:45,269
investigators might not have yeah the

1072
00:49:49,939 --> 00:49:46,979
great challenge with this that with this

1073
00:49:53,029 --> 00:49:49,949
effort is is being able to separate the

1074
00:49:57,949 --> 00:49:53,039
signal from the noise and you know I

1075
00:50:03,049 --> 00:49:57,959
think having more eyes more more experts

1076
00:50:05,120 --> 00:50:03,059
more you know more opinions frankly that

1077
00:50:08,839 --> 00:50:05,130
can weigh in and bring different

1078
00:50:10,249 --> 00:50:08,849
perspectives and skill sets to the table

1079
00:50:12,859 --> 00:50:10,259
will hopefully help us yield better

1080
00:50:14,509 --> 00:50:12,869
results I I've always believed in in

1081
00:50:18,709 --> 00:50:14,519
really employing a multidisciplinary

1082
00:50:20,329 --> 00:50:18,719
approach to the problem set at the ranch

1083
00:50:22,910 --> 00:50:20,339
you know I don't think you can just

1084
00:50:25,669 --> 00:50:22,920
simply bring on an astrophysicist or a

1085
00:50:28,400 --> 00:50:25,679
plasma physicist if you will to to be

1086
00:50:29,959 --> 00:50:28,410
able to render an opinion relative to

1087
00:50:33,289 --> 00:50:29,969
what is being seen I think you need to

1088
00:50:34,669 --> 00:50:33,299
bring people from from I think a number

1089
00:50:39,650 --> 00:50:34,679
of various disciplines and I think

1090
00:50:43,429 --> 00:50:39,660
having having some non scientists as

1091
00:50:48,199 --> 00:50:43,439
well having some some fresh eyes that

1092
00:50:51,469 --> 00:50:48,209
that may not employ the same approach

1093
00:50:54,079 --> 00:50:51,479
can help probably answer some of the

1094
00:50:56,870 --> 00:50:54,089
questions or at least open discussions

1095
00:50:58,489 --> 00:50:56,880
that will lead to truly understanding

1096
00:51:01,630 --> 00:50:58,499
what is happening but I've really wanted

1097
00:51:05,539 --> 00:51:01,640
to get to the bottom of the truth I I

1098
00:51:07,579 --> 00:51:05,549
and I I'm hopeful that's what we're what

1099
00:51:11,239 --> 00:51:07,589
we're doing right now will help us bring

1100
00:51:13,250 --> 00:51:11,249
that forward and yeah you mentioned

1101
00:51:14,930 --> 00:51:13,260
early about you know getting your

1102
00:51:16,670 --> 00:51:14,940
the investigator to bring his phone to

1103
00:51:20,690 --> 00:51:16,680
you so you get the the raw footage with

1104
00:51:22,730 --> 00:51:20,700
the metadata and if you do release data

1105
00:51:24,500 --> 00:51:22,740
I think it's really important to make

1106
00:51:26,630 --> 00:51:24,510
sure you release like all of the

1107
00:51:29,569 --> 00:51:26,640
contextual data around that and the

1108
00:51:32,089 --> 00:51:29,579
original footage and the original raw

1109
00:51:34,309 --> 00:51:32,099
files if possible and at the yeah kind

1110
00:51:38,750 --> 00:51:34,319
of big but you know data spaces is cheap

1111
00:51:40,730 --> 00:51:38,760
nowadays you know I would download a one

1112
00:51:42,140 --> 00:51:40,740
gigabyte video file if it meant I would

1113
00:51:44,839 --> 00:51:42,150
get a better version of that first so I

1114
00:51:46,370 --> 00:51:44,849
could analyze it a bit better so yeah

1115
00:51:48,440 --> 00:51:46,380
please sure if you're gonna upload that

1116
00:51:51,380 --> 00:51:48,450
there's a bunch of people like on meta

1117
00:51:53,000 --> 00:51:51,390
bunk my my website who just like doing

1118
00:51:54,890 --> 00:51:53,010
this type of thing we like looking at

1119
00:51:58,460 --> 00:51:54,900
videos and photos and trying to figure

1120
00:52:00,559 --> 00:51:58,470
out what's actually on on the on the on

1121
00:52:02,990 --> 00:52:00,569
the video or photo see is it a plane is

1122
00:52:05,089 --> 00:52:03,000
it a bird is it a a lien spaceship it's

1123
00:52:06,829 --> 00:52:05,099
it a army have secret drone you know

1124
00:52:08,809 --> 00:52:06,839
whatever it is you wanna find out what

1125
00:52:11,059 --> 00:52:08,819
it is and of course like a lot of the

1126
00:52:13,190 --> 00:52:11,069
time it ends up being a fairly mundane

1127
00:52:16,700 --> 00:52:13,200
but sometimes we can't figure out what

1128
00:52:19,160 --> 00:52:16,710
it is so yeah yeah it would be good to

1129
00:52:21,470 --> 00:52:19,170
use that resource not just meta bunk but

1130
00:52:23,450 --> 00:52:21,480
you know everybody on Twitter and and

1131
00:52:25,690 --> 00:52:23,460
Facebook and read it who are interested

1132
00:52:29,349 --> 00:52:25,700
in that type of thing as well yeah I

1133
00:52:34,069 --> 00:52:29,359
wanted to bring kind of a whole new

1134
00:52:37,309 --> 00:52:34,079
approach to this these topics you know

1135
00:52:39,500 --> 00:52:37,319
I've and you see this I mean I I've

1136
00:52:44,569 --> 00:52:39,510
really worked hard to be as transparent

1137
00:52:46,099 --> 00:52:44,579
as candid as I can relative to the

1138
00:52:50,480 --> 00:52:46,109
nature of our investigation or

1139
00:52:52,549 --> 00:52:50,490
motivations and and really what we're

1140
00:52:55,280 --> 00:52:52,559
what we're trying to accomplish here at

1141
00:52:57,760 --> 00:52:55,290
skinwalker ranch yeah you know I believe

1142
00:53:00,380 --> 00:52:57,770
that that this could very well be a

1143
00:53:03,890 --> 00:53:00,390
living laboratory of sorts it sure

1144
00:53:06,950 --> 00:53:03,900
appears to be that way based on the

1145
00:53:09,170 --> 00:53:06,960
diversity of phenomena that continues to

1146
00:53:11,859 --> 00:53:09,180
be recorded on the property I mean when

1147
00:53:15,770 --> 00:53:11,869
you when you when you bring together

1148
00:53:18,950 --> 00:53:15,780
data that confirms everything from the

1149
00:53:21,220 --> 00:53:18,960
electromagnetic anomalies to the acute

1150
00:53:24,970 --> 00:53:21,230
medical episodes that seem to accompany

1151
00:53:27,230 --> 00:53:24,980
these you know electromagnetic events

1152
00:53:29,810 --> 00:53:27,240
and and then you have

1153
00:53:33,109 --> 00:53:29,820
photographic or video graphic evidence

1154
00:53:36,350 --> 00:53:33,119
that also can accompany that coupled

1155
00:53:38,210 --> 00:53:36,360
with witness testimony you know multiple

1156
00:53:40,670 --> 00:53:38,220
witnesses so you're not just taking one

1157
00:53:43,070 --> 00:53:40,680
person's word for it you have multiple

1158
00:53:46,010 --> 00:53:43,080
parties that are attesting to the you

1159
00:53:47,750 --> 00:53:46,020
know to what is being observed I think

1160
00:53:51,770 --> 00:53:47,760
it gets interesting and that's what I

1161
00:53:53,840 --> 00:53:51,780
did not expect relative to the ranch as

1162
00:53:56,120 --> 00:53:53,850
I didn't expect that we would see so

1163
00:54:00,980 --> 00:53:56,130
much that we would see such a diversity

1164
00:54:03,080 --> 00:54:00,990
of activity and events and and you know

1165
00:54:04,910 --> 00:54:03,090
you talk about you know repeating

1166
00:54:06,740 --> 00:54:04,920
results you know being able to properly

1167
00:54:08,380 --> 00:54:06,750
characterize what is happening if you're

1168
00:54:10,790 --> 00:54:08,390
really going to have a scientific

1169
00:54:14,710 --> 00:54:10,800
investigation if you're really going to

1170
00:54:17,660 --> 00:54:14,720
use scientific rigor and and principles

1171
00:54:20,420 --> 00:54:17,670
you have to you have to build boundary

1172
00:54:24,320 --> 00:54:20,430
conditions around your investigation and

1173
00:54:26,690 --> 00:54:24,330
be able to to repeat and your your

1174
00:54:29,630 --> 00:54:26,700
experiments and at least be able to show

1175
00:54:31,880 --> 00:54:29,640
that there's that there's there's truly

1176
00:54:34,849 --> 00:54:31,890
something at work other than you know

1177
00:54:35,990 --> 00:54:34,859
you know something that it's just as

1178
00:54:37,580 --> 00:54:36,000
anomalous that you have to take

1179
00:54:39,560 --> 00:54:37,590
someone's word for it and and one thing

1180
00:54:42,410 --> 00:54:39,570
that we've seen that it's consistent is

1181
00:54:45,140 --> 00:54:42,420
the electromagnetic you know you the

1182
00:54:49,160 --> 00:54:45,150
cellphone anomalies you know Eric bard

1183
00:54:56,180 --> 00:54:49,170
his is conducted quite have been

1184
00:54:59,870 --> 00:54:56,190
research into what type of acute medical

1185
00:55:03,590 --> 00:54:59,880
episodes can accompany extreme

1186
00:55:06,740 --> 00:55:03,600
electromagnetic you know interference or

1187
00:55:08,990 --> 00:55:06,750
events you know you know what what you

1188
00:55:11,030 --> 00:55:09,000
know even the auditory phenomena that I

1189
00:55:13,310 --> 00:55:11,040
did I experienced you know I related to

1190
00:55:15,710 --> 00:55:13,320
you my experience of walking around the

1191
00:55:18,530 --> 00:55:15,720
back at the the old homestead and having

1192
00:55:20,510 --> 00:55:18,540
you know having this auditory sensation

1193
00:55:23,750 --> 00:55:20,520
where all the ambient noise was

1194
00:55:25,310 --> 00:55:23,760
essentially muted and it it truly felt

1195
00:55:29,480 --> 00:55:25,320
like I stepped into a soundproof chamber

1196
00:55:31,670 --> 00:55:29,490
of sorts and and you know it's

1197
00:55:35,390 --> 00:55:31,680
interesting you know electromagnetic

1198
00:55:39,460 --> 00:55:35,400
phenomena at times and you know that

1199
00:55:40,600 --> 00:55:39,470
kind of interference can actually create

1200
00:55:48,340 --> 00:55:40,610
those

1201
00:55:51,160 --> 00:55:48,350
Japan let's let's talk about the the

1202
00:55:53,260 --> 00:55:51,170
show the History Channel show it some of

1203
00:55:57,070 --> 00:55:53,270
what you said is stuff that was shown on

1204
00:56:00,460 --> 00:55:57,080
that show how did that I did that come

1205
00:56:01,600 --> 00:56:00,470
about did they approach you yes so a

1206
00:56:04,300 --> 00:56:01,610
good question

1207
00:56:07,090 --> 00:56:04,310
you know I was you know within months of

1208
00:56:10,780 --> 00:56:07,100
acquiring the property we we were

1209
00:56:14,980 --> 00:56:10,790
assaulted by numerous requests you know

1210
00:56:17,830 --> 00:56:14,990
I kept my identity completely private

1211
00:56:19,840 --> 00:56:17,840
in fact you you'd be hard-pressed if I

1212
00:56:21,580 --> 00:56:19,850
wouldn't have gone public there really

1213
00:56:24,150 --> 00:56:21,590
isn't anything on the title or in the

1214
00:56:27,880 --> 00:56:24,160
public domain that would actually tie my

1215
00:56:30,160 --> 00:56:27,890
my identity to the the entity to

1216
00:56:31,660 --> 00:56:30,170
adamantium real estate LLC which is a

1217
00:56:36,490 --> 00:56:31,670
special-purpose entity that I

1218
00:56:41,770 --> 00:56:36,500
established for owning and operating the

1219
00:56:43,630 --> 00:56:41,780
ranch and I really had no interest in in

1220
00:56:47,830 --> 00:56:43,640
opening the property up for a television

1221
00:56:49,810 --> 00:56:47,840
effort you know I was I was hit up for

1222
00:56:53,130 --> 00:56:49,820
about a year it was probably a solid

1223
00:56:55,330 --> 00:56:53,140
year where I was I was approached by

1224
00:56:58,030 --> 00:56:55,340
individuals involved with the History

1225
00:57:00,760 --> 00:56:58,040
Channel and a any network that wanted to

1226
00:57:03,610 --> 00:57:00,770
to pitch me on an investigative series

1227
00:57:06,730 --> 00:57:03,620
of sorts and after about a year I

1228
00:57:09,970 --> 00:57:06,740
finally I finally acquiesced to at least

1229
00:57:12,790 --> 00:57:09,980
take a meeting and hear what what you

1230
00:57:15,640 --> 00:57:12,800
know what they had in mind and and at

1231
00:57:17,590 --> 00:57:15,650
least be able to to close that door

1232
00:57:20,740 --> 00:57:17,600
closed that chapter in a respectful

1233
00:57:22,660 --> 00:57:20,750
manner and when we when we ended up

1234
00:57:27,460 --> 00:57:22,670
having those discussions initially which

1235
00:57:33,730 --> 00:57:27,470
was gosh I don't know October November

1236
00:57:38,670 --> 00:57:33,740
of hang all my years are running

1237
00:57:47,230 --> 00:57:41,470
2018

1238
00:57:51,250 --> 00:57:47,240
I was I was intrigued you know but it

1239
00:57:54,220 --> 00:57:51,260
wasn't until I actually met with Kevin

1240
00:57:57,520 --> 00:57:54,230
burns of prometheus entertain

1241
00:57:59,349 --> 00:57:57,530
who who's kind of the go-to guy I guess

1242
00:58:00,250 --> 00:57:59,359
for these type of programs on the

1243
00:58:02,410 --> 00:58:00,260
History Channel

1244
00:58:04,599 --> 00:58:02,420
you know when Kevin Burns flew out with

1245
00:58:08,650 --> 00:58:04,609
his team to meet with me after again

1246
00:58:11,530 --> 00:58:08,660
after a year of people bugging the hell

1247
00:58:14,290 --> 00:58:11,540
out of me through my managers and

1248
00:58:15,970 --> 00:58:14,300
through intermediaries I finally said

1249
00:58:17,950 --> 00:58:15,980
you know I'm willing to take a meeting

1250
00:58:21,780 --> 00:58:17,960
I'm willing to have a discussion and

1251
00:58:24,970 --> 00:58:21,790
when I sat down with with the group

1252
00:58:27,010 --> 00:58:24,980
representing the History Channel and in

1253
00:58:29,530 --> 00:58:27,020
pitching me on this

1254
00:58:33,160 --> 00:58:29,540
I shared my motivation my story but I

1255
00:58:37,150 --> 00:58:33,170
said look I'm not interested in any type

1256
00:58:42,510 --> 00:58:37,160
of effort that would that would involve

1257
00:58:46,420 --> 00:58:42,520
fabricating or you know faking you know

1258
00:58:48,880 --> 00:58:46,430
you know anything that would be

1259
00:58:52,840 --> 00:58:48,890
contrived I I've seen enough of these

1260
00:58:54,370 --> 00:58:52,850
stupid programs people tripping over

1261
00:58:56,620 --> 00:58:54,380
themselves in the dark with night-vision

1262
00:58:58,810 --> 00:58:56,630
goggles and I didn't want this effort

1263
00:59:01,050 --> 00:58:58,820
and really the nature of our

1264
00:59:04,960 --> 00:59:01,060
investigation reduced to that type of

1265
00:59:07,060 --> 00:59:04,970
program and I told them I said look if

1266
00:59:09,280 --> 00:59:07,070
we were to engage I have a number of

1267
00:59:11,740 --> 00:59:09,290
conditions number one it has to be

1268
00:59:13,960 --> 00:59:11,750
absolute truth everything that you

1269
00:59:17,230 --> 00:59:13,970
record everything that is displayed has

1270
00:59:21,580 --> 00:59:17,240
to be 100% true you can't fabricate

1271
00:59:23,800 --> 00:59:21,590
anything number two you're gonna have to

1272
00:59:26,560 --> 00:59:23,810
use my team I'm not interested in

1273
00:59:29,260 --> 00:59:26,570
casting people bringing in people from

1274
00:59:32,380 --> 00:59:29,270
the outside that may be front-loaded or

1275
00:59:34,780 --> 00:59:32,390
maybe you may have another agenda that

1276
00:59:36,790 --> 00:59:34,790
may run contrary that could undermine

1277
00:59:40,180 --> 00:59:36,800
the integrity of what we're doing and

1278
00:59:42,370 --> 00:59:40,190
you know I introduced my team which

1279
00:59:44,859 --> 00:59:42,380
which which includes people that I've

1280
00:59:47,470 --> 00:59:44,869
known my whole life at least since I was

1281
00:59:49,690 --> 00:59:47,480
18 years old and I said look you're

1282
00:59:52,720 --> 00:59:49,700
gonna have to you're going to have to

1283
00:59:54,880 --> 00:59:52,730
work with my team in order to preserve

1284
00:59:57,790 --> 00:59:54,890
the integrity in the authenticity of

1285
00:59:59,800 --> 00:59:57,800
what we are what we're doing out there

1286
01:00:04,090 --> 00:59:59,810
and in the base and that skinwalker

1287
01:00:07,510 --> 01:00:04,100
ranch number three I asked that my

1288
01:00:08,130 --> 01:00:07,520
identity identity be kept confidential I

1289
01:00:16,800 --> 01:00:08,140
did

1290
01:00:21,240 --> 01:00:16,810
want to come out and and have any of my

1291
01:00:24,990 --> 01:00:21,250
professional endeavors be compromised or

1292
01:00:27,540 --> 01:00:25,000
potentially distracted as a result of my

1293
01:00:31,650 --> 01:00:27,550
involvement with with this ranch and

1294
01:00:33,870 --> 01:00:31,660
with these efforts and as we met and we

1295
01:00:36,360 --> 01:00:33,880
visited you know they had no problem

1296
01:00:39,030 --> 01:00:36,370
granting me my my first two conditions

1297
01:00:42,230 --> 01:00:39,040
but they they they came back and said

1298
01:00:46,020 --> 01:00:42,240
look we we did not believe that we can

1299
01:00:50,010 --> 01:00:46,030
appropriately address the topic of the

1300
01:00:55,260 --> 01:00:50,020
ranch and really the team and and create

1301
01:00:57,240 --> 01:00:55,270
a credible investigative series without

1302
01:00:59,870 --> 01:00:57,250
your involvement without you

1303
01:01:04,020 --> 01:00:59,880
in essence coming out of the closet and

1304
01:01:07,620 --> 01:01:04,030
and being being brave enough to reveal

1305
01:01:09,900 --> 01:01:07,630
your identity and they said it you know

1306
01:01:13,890 --> 01:01:09,910
we really believe that that's essential

1307
01:01:17,280 --> 01:01:13,900
to to really preserving the integrity of

1308
01:01:20,520 --> 01:01:17,290
what what you're trying to to establish

1309
01:01:22,310 --> 01:01:20,530
here and and so I I had to give it a lot

1310
01:01:25,100 --> 01:01:22,320
of thought and I ultimately and

1311
01:01:27,720 --> 01:01:25,110
reluctantly agreed to participate

1312
01:01:30,030 --> 01:01:27,730
because I think they they had a point I

1313
01:01:32,250 --> 01:01:30,040
agreed I said look you know there's a

1314
01:01:35,760 --> 01:01:32,260
lot of people out there that have either

1315
01:01:37,560 --> 01:01:35,770
kept their identities secret or they

1316
01:01:39,870 --> 01:01:37,570
have not engaged with the community they

1317
01:01:44,250 --> 01:01:39,880
have not been forthcoming or transparent

1318
01:01:47,010 --> 01:01:44,260
they have they've sequestered themselves

1319
01:01:50,070 --> 01:01:47,020
away from the community and and frankly

1320
01:01:53,400 --> 01:01:50,080
have not been willing to come forward in

1321
01:01:55,950 --> 01:01:53,410
in in a collaborative way and and I

1322
01:01:58,830 --> 01:01:55,960
don't blame them I mean I I can

1323
01:02:03,090 --> 01:01:58,840
completely understand especially now why

1324
01:02:08,910 --> 01:02:03,100
so many credible people that are

1325
01:02:12,270 --> 01:02:08,920
interested in these topics avoid going

1326
01:02:14,070 --> 01:02:12,280
public with their interest or really

1327
01:02:15,630 --> 01:02:14,080
engaging with the public relative to

1328
01:02:18,390 --> 01:02:15,640
their interests even those with with

1329
01:02:18,900 --> 01:02:18,400
resources and honey does some kind of

1330
01:02:21,380 --> 01:02:18,910
blowback

1331
01:02:24,320 --> 01:02:21,390
from from your occurrences

1332
01:02:27,890 --> 01:02:24,330
your business dealings at all nah not

1333
01:02:30,920 --> 01:02:27,900
yet so thankfully you know III haven't

1334
01:02:33,740 --> 01:02:30,930
at least that I'm aware of I haven't I

1335
01:02:37,100 --> 01:02:33,750
haven't had any negative blowback but it

1336
01:02:39,470 --> 01:02:37,110
has been interesting you know to see all

1337
01:02:44,510 --> 01:02:39,480
of the the cast of characters involved

1338
01:02:46,730 --> 01:02:44,520
with with the community with ufology all

1339
01:02:49,550 --> 01:02:46,740
of the enthusiasts and you know I I have

1340
01:02:52,490 --> 01:02:49,560
to tell you I I think it's fun to engage

1341
01:02:54,530 --> 01:02:52,500
with people that that share similar

1342
01:02:56,900 --> 01:02:54,540
interests that that are that are really

1343
01:02:58,910 --> 01:02:56,910
approaching this sincerely that are

1344
01:03:00,920 --> 01:02:58,920
trying to get to the bottom of you know

1345
01:03:04,430 --> 01:03:00,930
what does it work with the UFO

1346
01:03:05,930 --> 01:03:04,440
phenomenon and other related claims but

1347
01:03:11,180 --> 01:03:05,940
I think there are a lot of people who

1348
01:03:13,130 --> 01:03:11,190
also have their own agendas and and you

1349
01:03:15,410 --> 01:03:13,140
know I think that historically speaking

1350
01:03:17,900 --> 01:03:15,420
there are a lot of bad actors I think

1351
01:03:20,630 --> 01:03:17,910
there are a lot of charlatans there are

1352
01:03:22,340 --> 01:03:20,640
a lot of there are a lot of

1353
01:03:26,030 --> 01:03:22,350
artists I don't know how else to put it

1354
01:03:29,090 --> 01:03:26,040
but I I think there I think being able

1355
01:03:31,820 --> 01:03:29,100
to separate fact from fiction and being

1356
01:03:34,730 --> 01:03:31,830
able to separate those who have egos or

1357
01:03:37,850 --> 01:03:34,740
trying to monetize their interest in

1358
01:03:41,540 --> 01:03:37,860
this from those that are truly sincerely

1359
01:03:43,520 --> 01:03:41,550
engaged in and really analyzing these

1360
01:03:45,470 --> 01:03:43,530
topics and really addressing them I mean

1361
01:03:47,720 --> 01:03:45,480
it's it it's a difficult task I

1362
01:03:50,060 --> 01:03:47,730
mentioned earlier you know this process

1363
01:03:52,850 --> 01:03:50,070
is is largely a process of trying to

1364
01:03:54,740 --> 01:03:52,860
separate the signal from the noise and I

1365
01:03:56,510 --> 01:03:54,750
think unfortunately the majority of what

1366
01:03:57,080 --> 01:03:56,520
you see out there right now is a lot of

1367
01:03:59,600 --> 01:03:57,090
noise

1368
01:04:01,550 --> 01:03:59,610
and it's difficult to be able to to

1369
01:04:06,530 --> 01:04:01,560
reach in and to be able to pierce that

1370
01:04:10,970 --> 01:04:06,540
into to extract the the real meaningful

1371
01:04:13,790 --> 01:04:10,980
data and an accounting that that are

1372
01:04:16,580 --> 01:04:13,800
legit yeah I says there's lots of noise

1373
01:04:17,780 --> 01:04:16,590
out there and you you specified in your

1374
01:04:20,330 --> 01:04:17,790
agreement that you wanted between

1375
01:04:22,190 --> 01:04:20,340
nothing fabricated in the show you know

1376
01:04:24,620 --> 01:04:22,200
let's say there are a few things that

1377
01:04:27,890 --> 01:04:24,630
we've discussed on Twitter that kind of

1378
01:04:32,690 --> 01:04:27,900
seem to verge on fabrication like for

1379
01:04:33,980 --> 01:04:32,700
example as episode for the high

1380
01:04:35,030 --> 01:04:33,990
strangeness this is the one with the

1381
01:04:37,370 --> 01:04:35,040
rocket launch

1382
01:04:39,830 --> 01:04:37,380
and the rain foam appearances there's a

1383
01:04:41,390 --> 01:04:39,840
scene there where they see this UFO in

1384
01:04:44,300 --> 01:04:41,400
the distance and they're all standing on

1385
01:04:46,700 --> 01:04:44,310
on the deck outside outside the ranch

1386
01:04:50,600 --> 01:04:46,710
house and right they're all looking up

1387
01:04:51,920 --> 01:04:50,610
at this this UFO and the weird thing is

1388
01:04:56,720 --> 01:04:51,930
that none of them have any binoculars

1389
01:04:58,640 --> 01:04:56,730
and they go on to say that then you know

1390
01:05:00,350 --> 01:04:58,650
this is they couldn't identify it and

1391
01:05:03,530 --> 01:05:00,360
they don't know what it is and it was

1392
01:05:05,180 --> 01:05:03,540
like weirdly glowing object but it seems

1393
01:05:07,010 --> 01:05:05,190
like if they had binoculars they would

1394
01:05:10,940 --> 01:05:07,020
have been to look at it and see that it

1395
01:05:13,550 --> 01:05:10,950
was you know probably just a plane seems

1396
01:05:15,800 --> 01:05:13,560
like that they don't seem like they're

1397
01:05:17,840 --> 01:05:15,810
part of a genuine investigation like if

1398
01:05:20,000 --> 01:05:17,850
people are there you know thinking that

1399
01:05:21,290 --> 01:05:20,010
they might see UFOs surely they would

1400
01:05:24,860 --> 01:05:21,300
have binoculars and it's especially

1401
01:05:27,710 --> 01:05:24,870
strange those lately in in episode 7 you

1402
01:05:29,750 --> 01:05:27,720
have another scene where a UFO or

1403
01:05:31,580 --> 01:05:29,760
something is spotted and there is a

1404
01:05:33,310 --> 01:05:31,590
helicopter the helicopter scene and

1405
01:05:34,820 --> 01:05:33,320
everybody is there with binoculars

1406
01:05:36,320 --> 01:05:34,830
that's right

1407
01:05:39,130 --> 01:05:36,330
there's this thing for different sets of

1408
01:05:43,250 --> 01:05:39,140
inoculation one guy with a long a long

1409
01:05:45,080 --> 01:05:43,260
telescope type saying yeah I I would say

1410
01:05:46,940 --> 01:05:45,090
the fact that when they were doing the

1411
01:05:48,170 --> 01:05:46,950
you know they're conducting the rocket

1412
01:05:51,980 --> 01:05:48,180
test the fact that they didn't have

1413
01:05:56,030 --> 01:05:51,990
binocular binoculars there frankly I

1414
01:05:57,680 --> 01:05:56,040
think proves that there wasn't something

1415
01:05:59,390 --> 01:05:57,690
contrived do they weren't all at the

1416
01:06:01,040 --> 01:05:59,400
ready I don't believe that anyone was

1417
01:06:05,330 --> 01:06:01,050
expecting that they're going to see some

1418
01:06:07,430 --> 01:06:05,340
silver discs in the sky yeah I actually

1419
01:06:12,290 --> 01:06:07,440
think that they were genuinely surprised

1420
01:06:14,660 --> 01:06:12,300
by that so I disagree a bit in that I

1421
01:06:16,790 --> 01:06:14,670
think that if they really were trying to

1422
01:06:22,700 --> 01:06:16,800
you know they were trying to anticipate

1423
01:06:26,120 --> 01:06:22,710
or believe that they were going to - to

1424
01:06:28,400 --> 01:06:26,130
take something that that that was

1425
01:06:32,030 --> 01:06:28,410
occurring in the the atmosphere and try

1426
01:06:34,010 --> 01:06:32,040
to try to I don't know conjurer I

1427
01:06:36,260 --> 01:06:34,020
wouldn't say it's fabricated as such but

1428
01:06:37,790 --> 01:06:36,270
it just seems rather odd that you know

1429
01:06:39,620 --> 01:06:37,800
if this is the type of thing they were

1430
01:06:41,150 --> 01:06:39,630
looking out for and they're gonna launch

1431
01:06:43,610 --> 01:06:41,160
a rocket you think they wouldn't

1432
01:06:45,890 --> 01:06:43,620
binoculars and their investigators yeah

1433
01:06:49,010 --> 01:06:45,900
from what I understand that the point of

1434
01:06:53,300 --> 01:06:49,020
the rocket test was not to stimulate

1435
01:06:55,340 --> 01:06:53,310
UFO activity was what it was to test you

1436
01:06:57,230 --> 01:06:55,350
know our outings I'm to the LM you know

1437
01:07:00,530 --> 01:06:57,240
it was it you know is equipped with

1438
01:07:01,850 --> 01:07:00,540
sensors and a bunch in order to to do

1439
01:07:04,910 --> 01:07:01,860
that I don't think there was an

1440
01:07:07,700 --> 01:07:04,920
expectation that it would trigger or act

1441
01:07:11,020 --> 01:07:07,710
as a catalyst for for revealing some

1442
01:07:14,300 --> 01:07:11,030
type of anomalous UFO activity and so I

1443
01:07:18,230 --> 01:07:14,310
actually think that that what you saw

1444
01:07:20,180 --> 01:07:18,240
captures there is so typical of so many

1445
01:07:22,400 --> 01:07:20,190
other UFO sightings where people are

1446
01:07:24,770 --> 01:07:22,410
like and Daanish they're not it they're

1447
01:07:27,440 --> 01:07:24,780
not expecting it not I will say that

1448
01:07:31,730 --> 01:07:27,450
most of the crew that were there that

1449
01:07:35,030 --> 01:07:31,740
witnessed it were very skeptical did not

1450
01:07:36,680 --> 01:07:35,040
believe in the you know the the reality

1451
01:07:38,870 --> 01:07:36,690
of the UFO phenomena they were just

1452
01:07:40,580 --> 01:07:38,880
there to do a job and I think you know

1453
01:07:42,260 --> 01:07:40,590
all of those people and I think they

1454
01:07:44,180 --> 01:07:42,270
were probably about a dozen people that

1455
01:07:48,620 --> 01:07:44,190
witnessed those events that occurred

1456
01:07:51,109 --> 01:07:48,630
over those minutes of filming the the

1457
01:07:53,300 --> 01:07:51,119
rocket exercise I think you know they

1458
01:07:56,359 --> 01:07:53,310
all came away quite surprised by what

1459
01:07:59,390 --> 01:07:56,369
they saw and so it's it is interesting

1460
01:08:02,510 --> 01:07:59,400
though on the helicopter incident I have

1461
01:08:04,430 --> 01:08:02,520
to give you really huge credit in fact I

1462
01:08:06,170 --> 01:08:04,440
appreciate your investigative efforts

1463
01:08:09,380 --> 01:08:06,180
and your due diligence and reaching out

1464
01:08:12,290 --> 01:08:09,390
and and frankly you know verifying that

1465
01:08:15,230 --> 01:08:12,300
there probably is a a conventional

1466
01:08:17,749 --> 01:08:15,240
explanation for that helicopter you know

1467
01:08:20,720 --> 01:08:17,759
they the helicopter probably did deviate

1468
01:08:22,130 --> 01:08:20,730
from its course you know to come you

1469
01:08:25,430 --> 01:08:22,140
know look over the ranch but that

1470
01:08:27,740 --> 01:08:25,440
doesn't necessarily signify you know

1471
01:08:30,950 --> 01:08:27,750
some covert surveillance of the property

1472
01:08:34,010 --> 01:08:30,960
and I really appreciated your diligence

1473
01:08:37,220 --> 01:08:34,020
and and really tracking that down and I

1474
01:08:39,680 --> 01:08:37,230
think that that yeah I think more of

1475
01:08:42,470 --> 01:08:39,690
that I think if we see more people like

1476
01:08:45,170 --> 01:08:42,480
you helping us to be able to identify

1477
01:08:48,019 --> 01:08:45,180
what what may have a conventional

1478
01:08:50,599 --> 01:08:48,029
explanation versus something that could

1479
01:08:52,940 --> 01:08:50,609
be you know unexplained will will help

1480
01:08:54,710 --> 01:08:52,950
advance the topic yeah that was quite a

1481
01:08:56,900 --> 01:08:54,720
tricky investigation actually because

1482
01:08:58,670 --> 01:08:56,910
there wasn't any ad SB data there there

1483
01:09:00,349 --> 01:08:58,680
was a big gap in the helicopter flying

1484
01:09:02,420 --> 01:09:00,359
from one side to the other so I couldn't

1485
01:09:03,830 --> 01:09:02,430
find it I had to do a bunch of

1486
01:09:06,370 --> 01:09:03,840
searching to trying to find out what

1487
01:09:09,230 --> 01:09:06,380
helicopter it was but I think you know I

1488
01:09:10,700 --> 01:09:09,240
appreciate that but I still feel like

1489
01:09:13,520 --> 01:09:10,710
there's there's some kind of unanswered

1490
01:09:16,660 --> 01:09:13,530
questions about what are how that was

1491
01:09:19,220 --> 01:09:16,670
betrayed on that episode in particular

1492
01:09:22,280 --> 01:09:19,230
you did have everybody looking up with

1493
01:09:26,600 --> 01:09:22,290
binoculars sure one guy with a gun scope

1494
01:09:28,190 --> 01:09:26,610
quite large long one and he should have

1495
01:09:30,110 --> 01:09:28,200
been able to see the number on the side

1496
01:09:33,500 --> 01:09:30,120
of the helicopter it was it was almost

1497
01:09:38,360 --> 01:09:33,510
visible in the 1080p video that you

1498
01:09:40,700 --> 01:09:38,370
write so yet and I wasn't there but I

1499
01:09:43,640 --> 01:09:40,710
from what I understand from all of the

1500
01:09:45,410 --> 01:09:43,650
participants they wet whether it be the

1501
01:09:49,100 --> 01:09:45,420
angle the helicopter whatever they

1502
01:09:51,980 --> 01:09:49,110
couldn't make out the numbers and you

1503
01:09:55,730 --> 01:09:51,990
know for what it's worth it's you know

1504
01:09:59,050 --> 01:09:55,740
it they made it into a more dramatic

1505
01:10:01,310 --> 01:09:59,060
event than it probably was I mean I I

1506
01:10:04,070 --> 01:10:01,320
that's one of the challenges with

1507
01:10:07,730 --> 01:10:04,080
television is and with this particular

1508
01:10:11,090 --> 01:10:07,740
medium is you know there is a bit of

1509
01:10:14,960 --> 01:10:11,100
drama you have the music you have the

1510
01:10:20,030 --> 01:10:14,970
way that the the content is edited that

1511
01:10:24,710 --> 01:10:20,040
can sometimes detract from you know the

1512
01:10:28,550 --> 01:10:24,720
credibility of the events or or to some

1513
01:10:31,190 --> 01:10:28,560
degree I think you know be be crafted in

1514
01:10:32,780 --> 01:10:31,200
such a way to elicit a response but what

1515
01:10:34,490 --> 01:10:32,790
we've endeavored to do it we're not

1516
01:10:37,580 --> 01:10:34,500
showing by for instance we're not

1517
01:10:39,980 --> 01:10:37,590
fabricating a helicopter yeah out of

1518
01:10:43,220 --> 01:10:39,990
thin air we're not trying to for

1519
01:10:46,990 --> 01:10:43,230
instance the also the UFO sighting that

1520
01:10:49,730 --> 01:10:47,000
the the people had their you know

1521
01:10:53,540 --> 01:10:49,740
simultaneous with the rocket experiment

1522
01:10:57,170 --> 01:10:53,550
I mean we we captured what was truly a

1523
01:11:00,080 --> 01:10:57,180
genuine authentic reaction from the cast

1524
01:11:02,570 --> 01:11:00,090
and crew associated with that with that

1525
01:11:04,670 --> 01:11:02,580
event and with the experimentation that

1526
01:11:09,020 --> 01:11:04,680
was happening same thing holds true you

1527
01:11:12,710 --> 01:11:09,030
probably recall the the balloon where

1528
01:11:14,360 --> 01:11:12,720
they balloon into them I mean the

1529
01:11:16,250 --> 01:11:14,370
gentleman I can't remember his name but

1530
01:11:19,310 --> 01:11:16,260
the the gentleman

1531
01:11:22,370 --> 01:11:19,320
who they brought out that that that

1532
01:11:26,690 --> 01:11:22,380
deployed the the balloon and the

1533
01:11:30,620 --> 01:11:26,700
instrumentation was and I think still is

1534
01:11:33,380 --> 01:11:30,630
truly baffled by the loss of the balloon

1535
01:11:36,470 --> 01:11:33,390
by what was recorded what he observed

1536
01:11:38,600 --> 01:11:36,480
and that's what we have tried to do with

1537
01:11:41,470 --> 01:11:38,610
probably varying levels of success is

1538
01:11:44,630 --> 01:11:41,480
we've tried to bring in third-party

1539
01:11:46,160 --> 01:11:44,640
engineers and experts whether we're

1540
01:11:48,470 --> 01:11:46,170
approaching it you know the ground

1541
01:11:50,840 --> 01:11:48,480
penetrating radar studies or the drone

1542
01:11:53,690 --> 01:11:50,850
thermography imaging relative to the

1543
01:11:55,130 --> 01:11:53,700
site you know we're you know we're

1544
01:11:58,250 --> 01:11:55,140
looking into deep ground-penetrating

1545
01:11:59,990 --> 01:11:58,260
measurement technologies and and you

1546
01:12:03,800 --> 01:12:00,000
know some of these other experiments in

1547
01:12:06,050 --> 01:12:03,810
order to in order to understand you know

1548
01:12:08,360 --> 01:12:06,060
what is at work here over the ranch and

1549
01:12:10,730 --> 01:12:08,370
you know so you don't have to take our

1550
01:12:13,850 --> 01:12:10,740
team's word for it I think we we've

1551
01:12:16,400 --> 01:12:13,860
tried to under the guidance of kind of

1552
01:12:18,710 --> 01:12:16,410
the production team and whatnot bring in

1553
01:12:22,520 --> 01:12:18,720
other third parties that can hopefully

1554
01:12:26,170 --> 01:12:22,530
help us advance the discussion yeah so

1555
01:12:29,360 --> 01:12:26,180
another thing that seems a little

1556
01:12:32,150 --> 01:12:29,370
perhaps since I sensationalized front of

1557
01:12:34,730 --> 01:12:32,160
a better word is the the the

1558
01:12:39,200 --> 01:12:34,740
electromagnetic radiation readings

1559
01:12:43,640 --> 01:12:39,210
thank you have Travis Taylor the the

1560
01:12:45,680 --> 01:12:43,650
scientists doing a lot of looking at his

1561
01:12:49,760 --> 01:12:45,690
Trifield meter and I have a Trifield

1562
01:12:51,410 --> 01:12:49,770
meter which I to go there are fun little

1563
01:12:53,330 --> 01:12:51,420
devices I mean they're essentially the

1564
01:12:56,120 --> 01:12:53,340
devices that are sold to people are kind

1565
01:12:58,700 --> 01:12:56,130
of a bit paranoid about EMF radiation in

1566
01:13:00,920 --> 01:12:58,710
their homes right and it works fairly

1567
01:13:02,330 --> 01:13:00,930
well he only goes up to 20 so it's

1568
01:13:05,390 --> 01:13:02,340
pretty low level and he goes for 20

1569
01:13:09,320 --> 01:13:05,400
milli watts per meter squared I'm gonna

1570
01:13:11,810 --> 01:13:09,330
turn it on see what I'm at now and it's

1571
01:13:13,580 --> 01:13:11,820
it's like the the types of the types of

1572
01:13:14,870 --> 01:13:13,590
numbers that you get on these these

1573
01:13:16,970 --> 01:13:14,880
track field meters they can I go all

1574
01:13:19,610 --> 01:13:16,980
over the place you know how close they

1575
01:13:22,910 --> 01:13:19,620
are to electrical equipment or to cell

1576
01:13:26,000 --> 01:13:22,920
phones and things like that and they can

1577
01:13:27,680 --> 01:13:26,010
very easily pay out just in a normal

1578
01:13:28,950 --> 01:13:27,690
situation like in my room here now

1579
01:13:29,940 --> 01:13:28,960
obviously you wouldn't expect that

1580
01:13:31,350 --> 01:13:29,950
you're out in the middle of the field

1581
01:13:34,050 --> 01:13:31,360
I've taken this out into the middle of

1582
01:13:35,640 --> 01:13:34,060
my field out back I also live on an old

1583
01:13:37,650 --> 01:13:35,650
ranch essentially as a housing

1584
01:13:42,450 --> 01:13:37,660
development that was once a ranch and it

1585
01:13:45,750 --> 01:13:42,460
is zero built on a graveyard

1586
01:13:47,310 --> 01:13:45,760
quite possibly quite possibly but only a

1587
01:13:49,800 --> 01:13:47,320
great deal of dead cows

1588
01:13:52,620 --> 01:13:49,810
this is the Trifield meter you know it

1589
01:13:55,350 --> 01:13:52,630
works you move it close to my Wi-Fi

1590
01:13:58,709 --> 01:13:55,360
router and it will it will go to a up to

1591
01:14:00,240 --> 01:13:58,719
20 it meets the maximum is that right

1592
01:14:04,110 --> 01:14:00,250
next to the microwave it will go up to

1593
01:14:06,330 --> 01:14:04,120
20 but when you see it in the show you

1594
01:14:08,130 --> 01:14:06,340
basically don't see that much difference

1595
01:14:10,110 --> 01:14:08,140
to do what I'm showing you here like it

1596
01:14:12,380 --> 01:14:10,120
pops up around to the low the load

1597
01:14:16,740 --> 01:14:12,390
numbers like 5 to 10 something like that

1598
01:14:19,590 --> 01:14:16,750
and it's it oscillates a lot and

1599
01:14:22,860 --> 01:14:19,600
especially if it's near a phone and in

1600
01:14:24,780 --> 01:14:22,870
all of the situations that you show

1601
01:14:25,890 --> 01:14:24,790
Travis getting excited and you waving it

1602
01:14:27,300 --> 01:14:25,900
around I think it's coming from here

1603
01:14:29,070 --> 01:14:27,310
it's coming from there and it's going

1604
01:14:30,750 --> 01:14:29,080
crazy and it's making the little beeping

1605
01:14:33,630 --> 01:14:30,760
noises the numbers don't really seem

1606
01:14:34,709 --> 01:14:33,640
that unusual to me especially given the

1607
01:14:36,900 --> 01:14:34,719
fact that there's a group of people

1608
01:14:37,979 --> 01:14:36,910
around some of them have their cell

1609
01:14:39,600 --> 01:14:37,989
phones and some of them are not on it

1610
01:14:42,390 --> 01:14:39,610
airplane mode you can actually see that

1611
01:14:44,670 --> 01:14:42,400
and some of the shots and most of them

1612
01:14:46,979 --> 01:14:44,680
are wearing wireless microphone packs

1613
01:14:49,140 --> 01:14:46,989
that are attached to the director back

1614
01:14:52,970 --> 01:14:49,150
and then some of them could be fairly

1615
01:14:57,570 --> 01:14:52,980
high power and I think 250 milli watt

1616
01:15:00,420 --> 01:14:57,580
power of transmission so what you're

1617
01:15:03,930 --> 01:15:00,430
seeing in the show doesn't look like

1618
01:15:05,940 --> 01:15:03,940
unusual levels of RF and would you agree

1619
01:15:08,459 --> 01:15:05,950
with that or what what do you think they

1620
01:15:11,010 --> 01:15:08,469
was unusual or was there like other sets

1621
01:15:14,670 --> 01:15:11,020
of readings and other equipments that

1622
01:15:17,610 --> 01:15:14,680
yes good good question good question

1623
01:15:20,430 --> 01:15:17,620
good observation I I'd say let me make a

1624
01:15:24,150 --> 01:15:20,440
blanket statement and that's in in both

1625
01:15:25,620 --> 01:15:24,160
dr. Taylor and dr. sigalas defense you

1626
01:15:28,229 --> 01:15:25,630
know you know what we're seeing

1627
01:15:31,260 --> 01:15:28,239
translated on the television program is

1628
01:15:34,410 --> 01:15:31,270
is a you know a number of quick edits

1629
01:15:37,260 --> 01:15:34,420
coupled with audio you know in the video

1630
01:15:39,120 --> 01:15:37,270
capturing their reactions and the events

1631
01:15:42,000 --> 01:15:39,130
that were unfolding and so I mean

1632
01:15:42,840 --> 01:15:42,010
they're there there are times when you

1633
01:15:46,440 --> 01:15:42,850
know whatever

1634
01:15:49,050 --> 01:15:46,450
whatever the cameramen are recording on

1635
01:15:50,940 --> 01:15:49,060
the handheld devices may not directly

1636
01:15:53,550 --> 01:15:50,950
correlate with with some of the

1637
01:15:56,790 --> 01:15:53,560
statements in the moment that are being

1638
01:16:00,330 --> 01:15:56,800
made by by the scientists and so you

1639
01:16:01,710 --> 01:16:00,340
know to a degree I think there there is

1640
01:16:03,780 --> 01:16:01,720
a little bit of a challenge with the

1641
01:16:06,060 --> 01:16:03,790
editing process again when you're trying

1642
01:16:09,600 --> 01:16:06,070
to approach an endeavor like this and to

1643
01:16:11,130 --> 01:16:09,610
present a cohesive narrative that that

1644
01:16:13,590 --> 01:16:11,140
that really accounts for what is

1645
01:16:17,960 --> 01:16:13,600
happening all that said is kind of a

1646
01:16:23,040 --> 01:16:17,970
preface to my next statement I mean I I

1647
01:16:27,180 --> 01:16:23,050
I'm not as familiar I mean I I don't

1648
01:16:32,370 --> 01:16:27,190
present myself as an expert on on these

1649
01:16:35,700 --> 01:16:32,380
devices and I'm probably not qualified

1650
01:16:38,370 --> 01:16:35,710
to really unfortunately speak to some of

1651
01:16:40,020 --> 01:16:38,380
your concerns the only thing I can say

1652
01:16:41,970 --> 01:16:40,030
and this will sound like such a cop-out

1653
01:16:43,770 --> 01:16:41,980
I know you're gonna chuckle is it you

1654
01:16:45,840 --> 01:16:43,780
know all I can say is I have three

1655
01:16:48,600 --> 01:16:45,850
scientists standing there especially

1656
01:16:52,560 --> 01:16:48,610
here I have two - I have two gentlemen

1657
01:16:54,300 --> 01:16:52,570
you know with PhDs in physics that have

1658
01:16:56,580 --> 01:16:54,310
worked with all sorts of electronics

1659
01:16:59,580 --> 01:16:56,590
that are very well acquainted with what

1660
01:17:01,140 --> 01:16:59,590
could be affecting the sensors at

1661
01:17:03,780 --> 01:17:01,150
different times that that is

1662
01:17:05,700 --> 01:17:03,790
conventional and when I when I have two

1663
01:17:07,920 --> 01:17:05,710
individuals you know one who has two

1664
01:17:10,710 --> 01:17:07,930
PhDs and three master's degrees and then

1665
01:17:14,190 --> 01:17:10,720
I have another one who has you know as a

1666
01:17:17,700 --> 01:17:14,200
PhD in masters as well in topics that

1667
01:17:19,740 --> 01:17:17,710
frankly approach you know you know the

1668
01:17:24,080 --> 01:17:19,750
the instrumentation and the physics

1669
01:17:27,330 --> 01:17:24,090
underpinning how these work you know I I

1670
01:17:30,900 --> 01:17:27,340
have to defer to them and whether their

1671
01:17:35,790 --> 01:17:30,910
assessment is in the moment and and I I

1672
01:17:38,730 --> 01:17:35,800
don't believe I I met dr. Taylor in

1673
01:17:40,530 --> 01:17:38,740
conjunction with engaging with with the

1674
01:17:44,160 --> 01:17:40,540
History Channel you know he was the one

1675
01:17:47,340 --> 01:17:44,170
he was the one party that they requested

1676
01:17:49,290 --> 01:17:47,350
would be you know potential scientists

1677
01:17:52,140 --> 01:17:49,300
to bring on to challenge the team and to

1678
01:17:55,800 --> 01:17:52,150
bring another set of eyes and I was I

1679
01:17:56,730 --> 01:17:55,810
was excited to bring him into into the

1680
01:17:59,820 --> 01:17:56,740
family

1681
01:18:01,590 --> 01:17:59,830
you will but you know dr. Sagawa I've

1682
01:18:03,900 --> 01:18:01,600
had old you know I've had years of

1683
01:18:07,320 --> 01:18:03,910
interaction with him and he has always

1684
01:18:10,700 --> 01:18:07,330
struck me as someone who employs the

1685
01:18:13,500 --> 01:18:10,710
scientific method and is is quite

1686
01:18:16,110 --> 01:18:13,510
measured and sober and his approach -

1687
01:18:18,210 --> 01:18:16,120
mm-hmm - really analyzing the data so

1688
01:18:20,900 --> 01:18:18,220
that's a really long-winded way of me

1689
01:18:24,450 --> 01:18:20,910
saying I don't really know how to

1690
01:18:26,460 --> 01:18:24,460
address specific questions you may have

1691
01:18:29,190 --> 01:18:26,470
relative to images flashing on the

1692
01:18:31,520 --> 01:18:29,200
screen and you know what what is being

1693
01:18:35,000 --> 01:18:31,530
observed and being able to again parse

1694
01:18:39,060 --> 01:18:35,010
that which may be associated with

1695
01:18:40,650 --> 01:18:39,070
interference as a result of the wireless

1696
01:18:42,750 --> 01:18:40,660
devices that are employed in the

1697
01:18:45,360 --> 01:18:42,760
recording and that which is not and

1698
01:18:47,400 --> 01:18:45,370
again I don't mean to sound like like

1699
01:18:51,060 --> 01:18:47,410
I'm trying to take the easy way out or

1700
01:18:52,980 --> 01:18:51,070
trying to kick the can down the road if

1701
01:18:55,410 --> 01:18:52,990
you will are trying to pass it off to

1702
01:18:57,420 --> 01:18:55,420
someone else but I I think that's

1703
01:18:59,550 --> 01:18:57,430
something that we need to look into look

1704
01:19:01,500 --> 01:18:59,560
more closely and frankly I think we're

1705
01:19:04,050 --> 01:19:01,510
going to be able to address that topic I

1706
01:19:07,620 --> 01:19:04,060
think a little bit more effectively in a

1707
01:19:10,200 --> 01:19:07,630
season two in further treatments yeah

1708
01:19:12,180 --> 01:19:10,210
one thing that that that I'm encouraged

1709
01:19:14,540 --> 01:19:12,190
by is it appears that we're going to

1710
01:19:19,230 --> 01:19:14,550
begin filming in short order

1711
01:19:22,440 --> 01:19:19,240
you know another you know 10 episodes

1712
01:19:25,440 --> 01:19:22,450
and in really launching into a season

1713
01:19:27,690 --> 01:19:25,450
two that will hopefully be able to

1714
01:19:31,680 --> 01:19:27,700
address some of these topics with a

1715
01:19:35,190 --> 01:19:31,690
little bit more diligence and and and

1716
01:19:37,320 --> 01:19:35,200
hopefully I think resolve some of the

1717
01:19:41,580 --> 01:19:37,330
concerns that have been man been brought

1718
01:19:43,890 --> 01:19:41,590
forward yeah no good yeah they and I

1719
01:19:45,810 --> 01:19:43,900
don't want to you know hop on the the

1720
01:19:47,600 --> 01:19:45,820
Trifield meter too much but it does

1721
01:19:50,880 --> 01:19:47,610
feature very strongly in the show and

1722
01:19:52,620 --> 01:19:50,890
and like you say like your scientists

1723
01:19:56,730 --> 01:19:52,630
aren't generally the ones where news

1724
01:19:58,770 --> 01:19:56,740
around is usually dr. Taylor and it's

1725
01:20:01,380 --> 01:19:58,780
not just him showing its near flashing

1726
01:20:03,150 --> 01:20:01,390
some numbers and and say and then being

1727
01:20:04,560 --> 01:20:03,160
suspicious he does actually talk about

1728
01:20:06,450 --> 01:20:04,570
those numbers as well I think in the

1729
01:20:09,810 --> 01:20:06,460
last episode of perhaps the previous one

1730
01:20:10,590 --> 01:20:09,820
he says like you know this is this is

1731
01:20:12,420 --> 01:20:10,600
like you know 40

1732
01:20:13,950 --> 01:20:12,430
or something like that and he says like

1733
01:20:16,440 --> 01:20:13,960
if I like held this outside of a

1734
01:20:19,160 --> 01:20:16,450
microwave it would be around 2 or 3 and

1735
01:20:21,780 --> 01:20:19,170
so 14 is like being inside the microwave

1736
01:20:24,960 --> 01:20:21,790
which is you know perhaps the most

1737
01:20:26,640 --> 01:20:24,970
nonsensical description of the levels

1738
01:20:28,200 --> 01:20:26,650
you could possibly imagine really for a

1739
01:20:29,790 --> 01:20:28,210
start if I hold this outside my

1740
01:20:32,400 --> 01:20:29,800
microwave it actually it actually will

1741
01:20:34,650 --> 01:20:32,410
peg out at 20 if you move it a bit

1742
01:20:36,210 --> 01:20:34,660
further away it will go down to 40 and

1743
01:20:39,140 --> 01:20:36,220
so suggesting that it's like the inside

1744
01:20:42,000 --> 01:20:39,150
of a microwave where the levels

1745
01:20:45,240 --> 01:20:42,010
literally let me top of my head like 50

1746
01:20:47,580 --> 01:20:45,250
thousand times higher for a thousand

1747
01:20:49,470 --> 01:20:47,590
watt microwave 50 thousand times higher

1748
01:20:52,320 --> 01:20:49,480
home perhaps 550 thousand times higher

1749
01:20:53,730 --> 01:20:52,330
than what he was suggesting as being the

1750
01:20:56,160 --> 01:20:53,740
inside of a microwave just doesn't make

1751
01:20:59,460 --> 01:20:56,170
any sense and it's it just it just

1752
01:21:02,460 --> 01:20:59,470
strikes me as being something being

1753
01:21:13,710 --> 01:21:02,470
played for drama rather than actual

1754
01:21:17,190 --> 01:21:13,720
science yeah and I all I can say is dr.

1755
01:21:19,800 --> 01:21:17,200
Taylor's credentials speak for

1756
01:21:22,280 --> 01:21:19,810
themselves dr. sagall his background his

1757
01:21:25,950 --> 01:21:22,290
credentials and whether they were

1758
01:21:28,950 --> 01:21:25,960
whether some of the edits had some of

1759
01:21:35,580 --> 01:21:28,960
the data lost in translation I'm not

1760
01:21:37,980 --> 01:21:35,590
sure I appreciate your your criticism

1761
01:21:40,440 --> 01:21:37,990
and your concern relative to to what is

1762
01:21:44,100 --> 01:21:40,450
shown in some of the the claims and what

1763
01:21:46,080 --> 01:21:44,110
was what was depicted and I I don't

1764
01:21:47,700 --> 01:21:46,090
really have a satisfactory answer for

1765
01:21:49,890 --> 01:21:47,710
you other than to say that I think we

1766
01:21:53,100 --> 01:21:49,900
had some highly competent people there

1767
01:21:57,240 --> 01:21:53,110
him making statements and I would be

1768
01:22:01,340 --> 01:21:57,250
very surprised if they were just making

1769
01:22:05,730 --> 01:22:01,350
stuff up or that they would go on camera

1770
01:22:10,130 --> 01:22:05,740
misrepresenting the nature of the data

1771
01:22:12,960 --> 01:22:10,140
or the readings just for the sake of

1772
01:22:14,730 --> 01:22:12,970
television yeah I think he approached

1773
01:22:16,710 --> 01:22:14,740
charities pleaded is just being a bit

1774
01:22:18,650 --> 01:22:16,720
overexcited about things and saying well

1775
01:22:20,910 --> 01:22:18,660
that came off the top of his head

1776
01:22:24,000 --> 01:22:20,920
because you know obviously he is a

1777
01:22:25,920 --> 01:22:24,010
scientist and he would know that he

1778
01:22:28,430 --> 01:22:25,930
wasn't inside a microwave at that point

1779
01:22:31,530 --> 01:22:28,440
so he was just going through a dramatic

1780
01:22:34,320 --> 01:22:31,540
interpretation of what was going on yeah

1781
01:22:37,800 --> 01:22:34,330
I don't have it I don't have specific

1782
01:22:40,950 --> 01:22:37,810
training in in these areas I I don't

1783
01:22:45,570 --> 01:22:40,960
have a PhD let alone multiple PhDs

1784
01:22:48,900 --> 01:22:45,580
addressing you know you know scientific

1785
01:22:52,050 --> 01:22:48,910
stock topics and instrumentation and I I

1786
01:22:54,420 --> 01:22:52,060
have to rely on people mm-hmm to to

1787
01:22:58,080 --> 01:22:54,430
hopefully give me proper analysis and

1788
01:23:01,080 --> 01:22:58,090
advise me appropriately and if anything

1789
01:23:06,420 --> 01:23:01,090
I think what this this television effort

1790
01:23:12,120 --> 01:23:06,430
has taught me is is to be more prepared

1791
01:23:14,520 --> 01:23:12,130
for questions I I I will admit I mean

1792
01:23:17,010 --> 01:23:14,530
let me confess I was not I was not

1793
01:23:20,640 --> 01:23:17,020
prepared for a lot of the questions that

1794
01:23:23,850 --> 01:23:20,650
would come forward right just simply

1795
01:23:26,090 --> 01:23:23,860
because a I'm dizzy I've got a lot of uh

1796
01:23:28,680 --> 01:23:26,100
this television show and this ranch

1797
01:23:31,950 --> 01:23:28,690
really constitutes a very very very

1798
01:23:34,800 --> 01:23:31,960
small part of my life and is not a part

1799
01:23:38,310 --> 01:23:34,810
of my day-to-day conventional activities

1800
01:23:40,490 --> 01:23:38,320
that have consumed my my my life and

1801
01:23:43,260 --> 01:23:40,500
career over the course the last 25 years

1802
01:23:47,970 --> 01:23:43,270
but also I'm going through a learning

1803
01:23:50,400 --> 01:23:47,980
experience as well and and you know it

1804
01:23:53,880 --> 01:23:50,410
I'd mentioned earlier at the the

1805
01:24:00,090 --> 01:23:53,890
beginning of our podcast you know this

1806
01:24:02,430 --> 01:24:00,100
is really a it's an evolution of really

1807
01:24:05,850 --> 01:24:02,440
bringing online the instrumentation

1808
01:24:08,370 --> 01:24:05,860
bringing the type of experts it's it's a

1809
01:24:10,740 --> 01:24:08,380
process not an event you know we haven't

1810
01:24:12,990 --> 01:24:10,750
had some seminal event where all of a

1811
01:24:16,250 --> 01:24:13,000
sudden we flip a switch and then all of

1812
01:24:20,160 --> 01:24:16,260
a sudden we have you know perfect data

1813
01:24:22,140 --> 01:24:20,170
that that that is you know critical

1814
01:24:25,980 --> 01:24:22,150
clear the right type of instrumentation

1815
01:24:29,130 --> 01:24:25,990
I hope to get there so my intention my

1816
01:24:32,510 --> 01:24:29,140
intention is to to to hopefully make

1817
01:24:35,610 --> 01:24:32,520
those improvements as we progress and

1818
01:24:37,920 --> 01:24:35,620
serve us to to really understanding what

1819
01:24:40,470 --> 01:24:37,930
we're seeing and and frankly to be

1820
01:24:45,120 --> 01:24:40,480
to give people like you an opportunity

1821
01:24:47,790 --> 01:24:45,130
to collaborate and to weigh in on what

1822
01:24:51,510 --> 01:24:47,800
we have recorded I I actually love that

1823
01:24:53,910 --> 01:24:51,520
you you took the time to even identify

1824
01:24:56,430 --> 01:24:53,920
that we with some of those images that

1825
01:24:58,920 --> 01:24:56,440
we flashed on the documentary for

1826
01:25:01,590 --> 01:24:58,930
example that we did have metadata that

1827
01:25:04,350 --> 01:25:01,600
accompanied those pictures I mean I I've

1828
01:25:07,830 --> 01:25:04,360
tried to to make sure that we're you

1829
01:25:10,800 --> 01:25:07,840
know that were that were credible that

1830
01:25:13,710 --> 01:25:10,810
we are that were that we're having

1831
01:25:16,530 --> 01:25:13,720
integrity with certainly appreciate an

1832
01:25:20,430 --> 01:25:16,540
investigation yeah so one last little

1833
01:25:25,730 --> 01:25:20,440
quibble I have with the the show is the

1834
01:25:29,400 --> 01:25:25,740
the fly the dark UFO over the dead cow

1835
01:25:31,860 --> 01:25:29,410
do you know from from my looking at it

1836
01:25:33,900 --> 01:25:31,870
he looks just like other videos of flies

1837
01:25:35,820 --> 01:25:33,910
flying by because it's in two rows and

1838
01:25:37,260 --> 01:25:35,830
it's a dark black blurry thing and it's

1839
01:25:39,600 --> 01:25:37,270
in about the right spot at the right

1840
01:25:42,240 --> 01:25:39,610
time and the right is a size and speed

1841
01:25:43,620 --> 01:25:42,250
and everything so that feature fairly

1842
01:25:45,330 --> 01:25:43,630
heavily and it seems like it might

1843
01:25:48,960 --> 01:25:45,340
feature in the next episode is there

1844
01:25:53,460 --> 01:25:48,970
more chatter you know all I can say is

1845
01:25:56,850 --> 01:25:53,470
there are many people that that that

1846
01:25:58,620 --> 01:25:56,860
have differing opinions again those that

1847
01:26:01,950 --> 01:25:58,630
were there the scientists that have

1848
01:26:04,170 --> 01:26:01,960
analyzed the footage you know all of the

1849
01:26:06,000 --> 01:26:04,180
events and again going back to you know

1850
01:26:09,540 --> 01:26:06,010
correlation does not necessarily mean

1851
01:26:13,560 --> 01:26:09,550
causation but it does make for some very

1852
01:26:14,910 --> 01:26:13,570
interesting some interesting discussion

1853
01:26:18,210 --> 01:26:14,920
and and frankly it

1854
01:26:19,920 --> 01:26:18,220
it helps us I think focus a lot of our

1855
01:26:23,550 --> 01:26:19,930
efforts a little bit better when we see

1856
01:26:26,220 --> 01:26:23,560
correlating events I think you know when

1857
01:26:29,310 --> 01:26:26,230
it comes to to your analysis I I haven't

1858
01:26:31,920 --> 01:26:29,320
to be honest I haven't had a chance to

1859
01:26:35,130 --> 01:26:31,930
even sit down with the team to review

1860
01:26:37,890 --> 01:26:35,140
the footage in a in a disciplined manner

1861
01:26:39,810 --> 01:26:37,900
in order to to ask you know how did we

1862
01:26:43,110 --> 01:26:39,820
come to these conclusions nine months

1863
01:26:46,350 --> 01:26:43,120
ago now me that's what what is somewhat

1864
01:26:49,680 --> 01:26:46,360
lost in in translation with a program

1865
01:26:52,010 --> 01:26:49,690
like this is you know these incidents

1866
01:26:56,120 --> 01:26:52,020
were recorded last summer

1867
01:26:58,130 --> 01:26:56,130
and a lot of the data the footage you

1868
01:27:00,530 --> 01:26:58,140
know a lot of the analysis that you see

1869
01:27:02,090 --> 01:27:00,540
projected on-screen

1870
01:27:05,090 --> 01:27:02,100
you know those conclusions were reached

1871
01:27:07,640 --> 01:27:05,100
quite a while ago and we haven't frankly

1872
01:27:10,520 --> 01:27:07,650
gone back and revisited these things and

1873
01:27:13,940 --> 01:27:10,530
and you know we up until now we haven't

1874
01:27:17,510 --> 01:27:13,950
really established a portal or a forum

1875
01:27:20,180 --> 01:27:17,520
to be able to engage peer review into to

1876
01:27:23,210 --> 01:27:20,190
I think provide some further analysis

1877
01:27:25,580 --> 01:27:23,220
and that that delves into some of these

1878
01:27:28,120 --> 01:27:25,590
claims and these events and I think

1879
01:27:32,630 --> 01:27:28,130
that's what we hope to hope to achieve

1880
01:27:35,270 --> 01:27:32,640
you know in in it's coincidental but you

1881
01:27:40,040 --> 01:27:35,280
know I would think that the period of

1882
01:27:42,230 --> 01:27:40,050
time in between season ones finale and a

1883
01:27:44,840 --> 01:27:42,240
season to air date you know hopefully

1884
01:27:49,160 --> 01:27:44,850
not only will we have our web portal and

1885
01:27:51,140 --> 01:27:49,170
our website that will will go live to

1886
01:27:52,910 --> 01:27:51,150
allow for some of these discussions to

1887
01:27:56,870 --> 01:27:52,920
continue but hopefully you know we may

1888
01:27:58,970 --> 01:27:56,880
be able to to further discuss and unwrap

1889
01:28:02,270 --> 01:27:58,980
the mystery involved with some of these

1890
01:28:04,160 --> 01:28:02,280
claims before the next episodes there I

1891
01:28:07,490 --> 01:28:04,170
will say that the team is mobilized

1892
01:28:10,040 --> 01:28:07,500
right now out in the basin I mean you

1893
01:28:13,220 --> 01:28:10,050
know just this morning I was receiving

1894
01:28:16,190 --> 01:28:13,230
updates from Eric bard from Thomas

1895
01:28:18,350 --> 01:28:16,200
Winterton from the command center where

1896
01:28:22,190 --> 01:28:18,360
they're installing new instrumentation

1897
01:28:25,520 --> 01:28:22,200
we have a we have a new up significantly

1898
01:28:28,100 --> 01:28:25,530
updated computer system that where we've

1899
01:28:31,850 --> 01:28:28,110
been putting into place that will that

1900
01:28:33,980 --> 01:28:31,860
will assist as well as a better backup

1901
01:28:37,220 --> 01:28:33,990
battery system I mean one of the things

1902
01:28:40,430 --> 01:28:37,230
that continues to frustrate me and the

1903
01:28:43,780 --> 01:28:40,440
team is is really how the equipment the

1904
01:28:45,170 --> 01:28:43,790
equipment just continues to have

1905
01:28:48,320 --> 01:28:45,180
challenges

1906
01:28:51,800 --> 01:28:48,330
I mean equipment equipment malfunctions

1907
01:28:53,300 --> 01:28:51,810
have been normal feasible thing there

1908
01:28:54,680 --> 01:28:53,310
there isn't it you you looking for

1909
01:28:57,050 --> 01:28:54,690
something that's repeatable and you've

1910
01:29:00,110 --> 01:28:57,060
got cell phones going wrong all the time

1911
01:29:02,720 --> 01:29:00,120
maybe she would I like a hundred iPhones

1912
01:29:05,470 --> 01:29:02,730
and you know arranged them in a grid

1913
01:29:07,840 --> 01:29:05,480
somewhere and and study what let's go

1914
01:29:09,880 --> 01:29:07,850
with these iPhones I would love to do

1915
01:29:11,650 --> 01:29:09,890
that in fact I think you know having a

1916
01:29:14,080 --> 01:29:11,660
daisy-chain of computers out at

1917
01:29:15,550 --> 01:29:14,090
homestead to and you know having them

1918
01:29:18,220 --> 01:29:15,560
put together and see if there's some

1919
01:29:21,010 --> 01:29:18,230
type of reaction or some type of

1920
01:29:22,780 --> 01:29:21,020
anomalous activity that can be recorded

1921
01:29:27,670 --> 01:29:22,790
associated with that effort would be

1922
01:29:29,470 --> 01:29:27,680
interesting in you know there is there

1923
01:29:30,850 --> 01:29:29,480
is repeatability when it comes to the

1924
01:29:32,950 --> 01:29:30,860
equipment malfunctions you know and a

1925
01:29:34,270 --> 01:29:32,960
number of people online have asked a

1926
01:29:36,070 --> 01:29:34,280
very good question they've said well if

1927
01:29:37,540 --> 01:29:36,080
your equipment is malfunctioning so

1928
01:29:39,880 --> 01:29:37,550
often if you're seeing battery

1929
01:29:41,410 --> 01:29:39,890
you know battery depletion and all of

1930
01:29:43,780 --> 01:29:41,420
these things how are you able to capture

1931
01:29:46,630 --> 01:29:43,790
these beautiful sweeping drone aerial

1932
01:29:48,880 --> 01:29:46,640
shots and you know your email record

1933
01:29:50,830 --> 01:29:48,890
these events in action and I think it's

1934
01:29:53,530 --> 01:29:50,840
important to note that a lot of the a

1935
01:29:56,200 --> 01:29:53,540
lot of the drone footage and whatnot you

1936
01:29:58,750 --> 01:29:56,210
know it may be recorded 15 minutes

1937
01:30:00,700 --> 01:29:58,760
before or after again through the

1938
01:30:04,990 --> 01:30:00,710
editing process they're trying to splice

1939
01:30:07,690 --> 01:30:05,000
together a cohesive narrative that that

1940
01:30:12,340 --> 01:30:07,700
will hopefully you know depict what is

1941
01:30:14,620 --> 01:30:12,350
happening in a in a inning I think in a

1942
01:30:16,990 --> 01:30:14,630
good manner that the the audience can

1943
01:30:19,360 --> 01:30:17,000
follow to it agreement I you know a lot

1944
01:30:22,780 --> 01:30:19,370
of those things I mean we've had so many

1945
01:30:25,479 --> 01:30:22,790
drones go down we've had so many cameras

1946
01:30:29,320 --> 01:30:25,489
that have ended up malfunctioning I mean

1947
01:30:31,510 --> 01:30:29,330
we had a whole we had a whole sequence

1948
01:30:33,910 --> 01:30:31,520
where where we had ground penetrating

1949
01:30:37,330 --> 01:30:33,920
radar studies conducted up on the Mesa

1950
01:30:41,350 --> 01:30:37,340
and all of the footage associated with

1951
01:30:45,820 --> 01:30:41,360
that study ended up disappearing off of

1952
01:30:49,920 --> 01:30:45,830
the digital drives I'm not trying to

1953
01:30:54,280 --> 01:30:49,930
assign some alien cause to it

1954
01:30:57,450 --> 01:30:54,290
but it is interesting and and again it

1955
01:31:01,810 --> 01:30:57,460
what it what it does is it it drives us

1956
01:31:04,330 --> 01:31:01,820
to further investigate that you know go

1957
01:31:07,030 --> 01:31:04,340
back and try to repeat that study and

1958
01:31:09,790 --> 01:31:07,040
and to try to get to the bottom of what

1959
01:31:12,160 --> 01:31:09,800
really is at work well I'm looking

1960
01:31:16,000 --> 01:31:12,170
forward to the final episode next week

1961
01:31:17,850 --> 01:31:16,010
and you know the the the next season

1962
01:31:20,220 --> 01:31:17,860
next year I guess it would come out

1963
01:31:22,530 --> 01:31:20,230
yeah I'd be it should be interesting

1964
01:31:24,180 --> 01:31:22,540
it'll be it will be interesting I really

1965
01:31:27,960 --> 01:31:24,190
appreciate your interest in this topic

1966
01:31:31,770 --> 01:31:27,970
and I appreciate all those online that

1967
01:31:35,970 --> 01:31:31,780
that have added their enthusiasm it's

1968
01:31:38,310 --> 01:31:35,980
it's fun to see discussion erupt around

1969
01:31:43,020 --> 01:31:38,320
these topics and I I think that's one of

1970
01:31:45,180 --> 01:31:43,030
the reasons why I why I agreed to to

1971
01:31:46,950 --> 01:31:45,190
this investigative series in this

1972
01:31:50,070 --> 01:31:46,960
television program is I felt like this

1973
01:31:54,930 --> 01:31:50,080
was an opportunity to give people the

1974
01:31:57,690 --> 01:31:54,940
chance to to see the property to to

1975
01:31:59,820 --> 01:31:57,700
actually accompany the team and and I

1976
01:32:02,670 --> 01:31:59,830
think we're missing that in this field

1977
01:32:04,200 --> 01:32:02,680
of inquiry I mean you how long have you

1978
01:32:06,510 --> 01:32:04,210
been at this how long have you been

1979
01:32:11,760 --> 01:32:06,520
investigating claims of this nature no

1980
01:32:18,120 --> 01:32:11,770
okay over 16 years now I think okay so

1981
01:32:22,710 --> 01:32:18,130
in all of your years I mean have you a I

1982
01:32:25,140 --> 01:32:22,720
mean it have you had have you seen

1983
01:32:28,290 --> 01:32:25,150
anything of this ft anything of this

1984
01:32:28,830 --> 01:32:28,300
magnitude brought forward in a public

1985
01:32:32,610 --> 01:32:28,840
fashion

1986
01:32:35,460 --> 01:32:32,620
yes transparently no I mean it's it's

1987
01:32:37,170 --> 01:32:35,470
certainly in terms of like supernatural

1988
01:32:41,010 --> 01:32:37,180
type things I suppose anything go to

1989
01:32:42,660 --> 01:32:41,020
compare it to is the recent UFO video

1990
01:32:45,480 --> 01:32:42,670
releases which got a lot of attention

1991
01:32:48,300 --> 01:32:45,490
but there you didn't really have the

1992
01:32:49,890 --> 01:32:48,310
degree of openness that you have you

1993
01:32:52,860 --> 01:32:49,900
know what you have here is kind of a

1994
01:32:54,540 --> 01:32:52,870
strange blend you have on the one hand

1995
01:32:55,860 --> 01:32:54,550
you're very accessible and that you you

1996
01:32:58,280 --> 01:32:55,870
talk to people and you're talking to me

1997
01:33:00,540 --> 01:32:58,290
now but on the other hand we've got

1998
01:33:03,000 --> 01:33:00,550
we're seeing things through the lens of

1999
01:33:05,460 --> 01:33:03,010
this show which does appear to be very

2000
01:33:07,890 --> 01:33:05,470
sensational license and sometimes you

2001
01:33:10,200 --> 01:33:07,900
know kind of formulating a narrative at

2002
01:33:13,680 --> 01:33:10,210
the expense of the actual you know what

2003
01:33:16,740 --> 01:33:13,690
actually went on so so yeah it's great

2004
01:33:18,630 --> 01:33:16,750
to have always openness but it's also in

2005
01:33:21,300 --> 01:33:18,640
double edged sword that because you're

2006
01:33:23,610 --> 01:33:21,310
presenting a lot of stuff which makes me

2007
01:33:25,710 --> 01:33:23,620
more skeptical rather than my skeptical

2008
01:33:28,590 --> 01:33:25,720
yeah it's a little bit of a no-win

2009
01:33:31,740 --> 01:33:28,600
situation though yeah it you know how

2010
01:33:34,950 --> 01:33:31,750
you know what is the perfect medium for

2011
01:33:36,930 --> 01:33:34,960
really engaging Public Interest stimuli

2012
01:33:39,120 --> 01:33:36,940
would be it would be Dropbox you could

2013
01:33:41,610 --> 01:33:39,130
just stick to terabytes of data on

2014
01:33:42,540 --> 01:33:41,620
Dropbox and I would point went to meet

2015
01:33:44,850 --> 01:33:42,550
the ones that you think of the most

2016
01:33:48,990 --> 01:33:44,860
interesting and yeah

2017
01:33:51,570 --> 01:33:49,000
for you yes and you're the anomaly I

2018
01:33:53,430 --> 01:33:51,580
think as far as the general public is

2019
01:33:56,940 --> 01:33:53,440
concerned and whatnot and trying to and

2020
01:34:00,570 --> 01:33:56,950
again trying to trying to establish the

2021
01:34:02,670 --> 01:34:00,580
right type of vehicle for disseminating

2022
01:34:05,760 --> 01:34:02,680
information relative to these topics of

2023
01:34:08,010 --> 01:34:05,770
the ranch it's it's a challenge and I'll

2024
01:34:09,960 --> 01:34:08,020
you know I've admitted that online I

2025
01:34:11,910 --> 01:34:09,970
mean it's it that has been part of the

2026
01:34:14,070 --> 01:34:11,920
learning process that I've been going

2027
01:34:17,100 --> 01:34:14,080
through over the course of the last year

2028
01:34:20,190 --> 01:34:17,110
especially the last two months as this

2029
01:34:23,360 --> 01:34:20,200
as this program has aired is that you

2030
01:34:27,060 --> 01:34:23,370
know it's very challenging when you're

2031
01:34:30,330 --> 01:34:27,070
on one hand you're trying to convince

2032
01:34:34,530 --> 01:34:30,340
people like you that that are looking at

2033
01:34:37,800 --> 01:34:34,540
it from a a a skeptical you know purely

2034
01:34:40,440 --> 01:34:37,810
data driven and scientific driven

2035
01:34:42,900 --> 01:34:40,450
perspective you know trying to make sure

2036
01:34:46,920 --> 01:34:42,910
that we appropriately address your

2037
01:34:51,180 --> 01:34:46,930
concerns and that that frankly that that

2038
01:34:55,310 --> 01:34:51,190
which is presented is supported by the

2039
01:34:59,700 --> 01:34:55,320
right type of data and media that would

2040
01:35:04,290 --> 01:34:59,710
that would pass muster with it that

2041
01:35:07,710 --> 01:35:04,300
would frankly I think to resolve your

2042
01:35:09,420 --> 01:35:07,720
concerns yet still be balanced with the

2043
01:35:14,850 --> 01:35:09,430
I guess what you would call the

2044
01:35:17,730 --> 01:35:14,860
entertainment value or the the the the

2045
01:35:21,330 --> 01:35:17,740
other functions that we're trying to be

2046
01:35:23,270 --> 01:35:21,340
in a channel yesterday channel needs to

2047
01:35:25,340 --> 01:35:23,280
make some money out of that show so they

2048
01:35:28,020 --> 01:35:25,350
they need a certain degree of

2049
01:35:29,370 --> 01:35:28,030
entertainment effective sure and you

2050
01:35:33,690 --> 01:35:29,380
know what I would I would probably

2051
01:35:36,060 --> 01:35:33,700
encourage I'd encourage you to keep this

2052
01:35:38,580 --> 01:35:36,070
in mind and others that are true are

2053
01:35:41,730 --> 01:35:38,590
tuning into this podcast you know have

2054
01:35:44,250 --> 01:35:41,740
fun with it you know it at times you

2055
01:35:45,719 --> 01:35:44,260
know you we can take ourselves too

2056
01:35:48,359 --> 01:35:45,729
seriously sometimes

2057
01:35:51,569 --> 01:35:48,369
I'm not saying that we should ever be

2058
01:35:54,390 --> 01:35:51,579
cavalier when we're addressing such bold

2059
01:35:58,410 --> 01:35:54,400
claims and topics but I think yeah I

2060
01:36:00,989 --> 01:35:58,420
think at times you know people need to

2061
01:36:04,259 --> 01:36:00,999
people need to have fun with it and

2062
01:36:05,790 --> 01:36:04,269
understand that this is it's not perfect

2063
01:36:10,819 --> 01:36:05,800
especially when you're dealing with

2064
01:36:13,080 --> 01:36:10,829
television oh my goodness it it is not a

2065
01:36:14,149 --> 01:36:13,090
starting my battery was going dead there

2066
01:36:17,069 --> 01:36:14,159
for a minute

2067
01:36:20,819 --> 01:36:17,079
it's it's not necessarily a perfect

2068
01:36:23,609 --> 01:36:20,829
medium for introducing scientific topics

2069
01:36:27,359 --> 01:36:23,619
to the public and in Carlson Carl Sagan

2070
01:36:30,330 --> 01:36:27,369
did a masterful job with cosmos yeah and

2071
01:36:33,989 --> 01:36:30,340
I'll be the first to admit that this

2072
01:36:37,620 --> 01:36:33,999
ain't cosmos this is a this is an

2073
01:36:38,399 --> 01:36:37,630
adventure and hey and uh yeah I want it

2074
01:36:42,589 --> 01:36:38,409
to be fun

2075
01:36:45,689 --> 01:36:42,599
you know of course I want this to be

2076
01:36:48,989 --> 01:36:45,699
this to be interesting and we hope that

2077
01:36:54,330 --> 01:36:48,999
people follow our journey and and

2078
01:36:57,000 --> 01:36:54,340
they're similarly inspired and and that

2079
01:36:58,560 --> 01:36:57,010
their that their imaginations and that

2080
01:37:02,459 --> 01:36:58,570
their interest is captured through all

2081
01:37:04,140 --> 01:37:02,469
of this I I I'm looking forward to

2082
01:37:06,629 --> 01:37:04,150
continuing the journey with everyone

2083
01:37:08,660 --> 01:37:06,639
this is my journey so you know I started

2084
01:37:12,149 --> 01:37:08,670
off on this path over four years ago

2085
01:37:14,489 --> 01:37:12,159
truly as a skeptic you've seen I wasn't

2086
01:37:16,979 --> 01:37:14,499
someone who is in the domain I wasn't

2087
01:37:21,149 --> 01:37:16,989
participating in the UFO community in

2088
01:37:26,549 --> 01:37:21,159
any way and wasn't engaging people

2089
01:37:28,709 --> 01:37:26,559
relative to these topics and I I you

2090
01:37:31,830 --> 01:37:28,719
know I I surprised me ended up being

2091
01:37:35,850 --> 01:37:31,840
swept up in this in this effort as a

2092
01:37:38,430 --> 01:37:35,860
result of my own my own experience with

2093
01:37:41,009 --> 01:37:38,440
other witnesses and if I wouldn't have

2094
01:37:43,890 --> 01:37:41,019
had multiple witnesses with me on that

2095
01:37:45,270 --> 01:37:43,900
fateful day and those events you know

2096
01:37:47,419 --> 01:37:45,280
that fateful day of events that I

2097
01:37:49,979 --> 01:37:47,429
related to you earlier on this podcast

2098
01:37:52,199 --> 01:37:49,989
if I wouldn't have had those witnesses

2099
01:37:58,160 --> 01:37:52,209
with me coupled with all of the other

2100
01:38:05,600 --> 01:38:01,400
I don't know that you know in retrospect

2101
01:38:06,980 --> 01:38:05,610
it would be very easy to dismiss you

2102
01:38:09,800 --> 01:38:06,990
know those things as well admit maybe

2103
01:38:11,600 --> 01:38:09,810
that you know maybe I'd somehow tricked

2104
01:38:14,450 --> 01:38:11,610
myself into thinking that I was seeing

2105
01:38:18,380 --> 01:38:14,460
something but it's very difficult to

2106
01:38:20,450 --> 01:38:18,390
trick for a whole host of witnesses from

2107
01:38:26,030 --> 01:38:20,460
different backgrounds that are not part

2108
01:38:27,830 --> 01:38:26,040
of the same fraternity if you will to

2109
01:38:29,720 --> 01:38:27,840
all weigh in on it and have the exact

2110
01:38:32,900 --> 01:38:29,730
same experience and those to be coupled

2111
01:38:36,170 --> 01:38:32,910
with with all of these other events so I

2112
01:38:39,710 --> 01:38:36,180
really appreciate your your invitation

2113
01:38:42,140 --> 01:38:39,720
to come on I'll restate my invitation

2114
01:38:46,340 --> 01:38:42,150
that you're welcome to come out to the

2115
01:38:48,490 --> 01:38:46,350
ranch and accompany dragon on his patrol

2116
01:38:51,590 --> 01:38:48,500
of the ranch if you wish in the future

2117
01:38:53,450 --> 01:38:51,600
you know I I probably should say this

2118
01:38:55,460 --> 01:38:53,460
since this is in a public forum and

2119
01:38:59,030 --> 01:38:55,470
you're going to be publishing this which

2120
01:39:01,540 --> 01:38:59,040
is the idea you know because this is an

2121
01:39:05,060 --> 01:39:01,550
active scientific investigation and

2122
01:39:08,480 --> 01:39:05,070
we're trying to to maintain certain

2123
01:39:11,570 --> 01:39:08,490
protocols and security and maintain the

2124
01:39:13,910 --> 01:39:11,580
integrity that investigation which is

2125
01:39:16,100 --> 01:39:13,920
ongoing we really don't have the ability

2126
01:39:19,280 --> 01:39:16,110
to open this up to the public I do not

2127
01:39:21,860 --> 01:39:19,290
have any intention I have zero intention

2128
01:39:25,490 --> 01:39:21,870
of ever opening this up to the public

2129
01:39:30,050 --> 01:39:25,500
for tours you know making some type of

2130
01:39:32,600 --> 01:39:30,060
tourist attraction out of it I for one I

2131
01:39:34,640 --> 01:39:32,610
truly believe that there's danger you

2132
01:39:37,130 --> 01:39:34,650
know people have been hurt we've had a

2133
01:39:38,920 --> 01:39:37,140
number of people that have unfortunately

2134
01:39:41,600 --> 01:39:38,930
ended up in the hospital with

2135
01:39:43,580 --> 01:39:41,610
unexplained illnesses I believe as a

2136
01:39:45,740 --> 01:39:43,590
result of some of the activities and

2137
01:39:47,930 --> 01:39:45,750
their engagement on the ranch and we

2138
01:39:49,430 --> 01:39:47,940
take that very seriously and that's a

2139
01:39:52,940 --> 01:39:49,440
part of our investigation we're trying

2140
01:39:55,310 --> 01:39:52,950
to get to the bottom of what is really

2141
01:39:59,330 --> 01:39:55,320
at work to answer some of those

2142
01:40:02,510 --> 01:39:59,340
questions so anyhow yeah thank you thank

2143
01:40:04,070 --> 01:40:02,520
you very much for sharing your story and

2144
01:40:05,870 --> 01:40:04,080
your experiences and your what you're

2145
01:40:09,800 --> 01:40:05,880
going to do in the future and they look

2146
01:40:11,750 --> 01:40:09,810
forward to to see what happens in the

2147
01:40:13,430 --> 01:40:11,760
future so thank you very much

2148
01:40:15,980 --> 01:40:13,440
here you're welcome and thank you for

2149
01:40:17,210 --> 01:40:15,990
the dialog it's great okay and you have

2150
01:40:20,690 --> 01:40:17,220
a have a good weekend

2151
01:40:22,790 --> 01:40:20,700
hey you two enjoy and stay in touch feel

2152
01:40:25,160 --> 01:40:22,800
free I look forward to continuing our

2153
01:40:26,210 --> 01:40:25,170
dialogue in the future and did okay

2154
01:40:27,400 --> 01:40:26,220
thank you a lot to you